A little more power

[brew]

Hi Every one
I have a 79 Vet and want to freshen up the engine this fall, I have the 195 Horse 350, So what can I do to get some were around 250 to 300 horse from this engine???? I will take the engine down to the bare block and have if acid cleaned, after that what cam, intake, carb, roller rockers, there is so much were does one know what is the right match so every thing works the way it should??? I do not want some thing I can not drive on the road, this is a driver. I want to make that trip down 66 once befor I get ot old.
Any one got any good ideas????
Thanks
Brew

 

[MaineShark]

If you're talking about stripping the block down to bare, and then rebuilding it completely, there are a couple things to consider:

Crate engines (if building it yourself isn't overly important) are a "known quantity" - they are proven combinations that produce a specific amount of power (with some variance between engines, obviously) and usually come with some form of warranty. GM Performance Parts has a variety of engines, as do many aftermarket suppliers.

If you're going to rebuild it, yourself, there is always the opportunity to bore-and-stroke it. There are 383 kits available with cranks that will drop right in to your existing block (no need to machine the bearing journals of a stock 400sbc crank to fit the 350-block) and come pre-balanced, with matched connecting rods and pistons.

A 383 is a very common engine size, for those looking for "a little more power," since it means that you can build the engine milder (less horsepower per cubic inch), and still get the same power level. Milder generally means more reliable.

In any case, an idea of your budget would help.

Joe

 

[brew]

That sounds like a good idea, I have thought about a crate engine but I think I would like to keep the the same block. The 383 kit in Summit says that it needs balanced? I just built a 383 big block for my Plymouth, This is my first Vet and I do not know much about GMs small blocks, The stocker kit does sound the best, for a good torquey motor, I have a 370 rear and it is just to high for touring, We just injoy driving around taking short trips. What kind of money would it be to have it bored and a stroker kit to put in, what kind of cam, and intake???
Thanks
Brew

 

[brew]

PS Joe
About $3000 is what I would like to spend.

 

[MaineShark]

Check out this link for starters.

I'm not sure which 383 kit you're looking at (Summit has several), but there are a variety, from numerous manufacturers. There are two types of balance,as well. There are internally and externally balanced kits, which determines whether you need a 400-block flexplate&damper, or your regular 350-block flexplate&damper. That refers to harmonic balance. There is also the question of the regular balance - some kits are pre-balanced, while some need to be balanced prior to assembly. I think it's probably best to get a pre-balanced kit, since the manufacturer is likely to charge less to balance it than a machine shop will.

I think $3000 would be plenty to do it, if you can do most of the assembly work yourself. The HotRod article puts the cost around $2000, but they don't include a lot of the little bits.

I happened across this page while searching for some ideas for my future 406 engine. With 109 different engines to look through, I'm sure you'll get some ideas.

Things to watch out for: the hood is low. Tall, high-rise intakes (eg, Victor Jr) won't fit under the stock hood. I don't even think that the Performer RPM will fit. Look for things like the Edelbrock Performer intake, to make hood clearance easier. A tall air cleaner on a low intake will probably work better than a tall intake with a short air cleaner, for a motor designed for torque.

Also, unless you plan on doing a lot of work replacing other systems, you need to have good vacuum. Most everything on the car uses vacuum to operate, so an engine that produces decent vacuum is a must. If you're looking for a "larger" ($$$) project, you can replace the brake booster with a hydraulic unit, the headlight actuators with electric motors, the entire climate control system with one from Vintage Air, etc., but that's not a small project.

Lastly, I might suggest that aiming a bit higher than your "250-300" numbers might be a better bet. Not that the car would be a total dog, but I'm running approx. 250 hp (200 rear-wheel, so right around 240-250 crank) in my car, and I'm certainly looking for more. It's a heavy car, and it takes a bit to get moving...

Personally, I'd set 383 hp as a goal, just on the principle of getting one horse per cubic inch. Or maybe 383 ft-lbs of torque, since torque is your real goal.

I think that you should also be prepared for the little expenses. Before you get started actually buying anything, start a list and write down every last part, and the best price you could find for it (and remember to write down who had that price - don't ask how I know). Add it all up, and see if you are comfortable with that price. Then at 50% more, as a "safety zone." If it's still something you are willing to deal with, then you can feel comfortable that you won't have any nasty suprises in your checkbook.

Joe

 

[MoeJr]

No need to go to 383 CID to get good reliable horsepower. If you are gonna tear it completely down do a simple .030 overbore, Have the heads done with 3 angle valves and milled .030 to get the Compression ratio up a bit. Order a standard 350 master rebuild kit from Northern Auto Parts without the cam and lifters. Get a cam kit from Summit racing under their own brand with the following specs Duration at .050= 224Int/234Exh. Lift= .465 Int/.488 exhaust on a 114 LSA. Have your stock distributor reworked or use an Accel HEI set timing at 12 degrees BTDC with vac. advance disconnected. Have stock QJet carb rebuilt and richen secondaries(I can help with this if you need). use a Edelbrock Performer Intake with stock air cleaner and induction set up. If you have an automatic get a 2400 stall converter. use the chambered exhaust from Mid AMerica and you should have an engine that will please you with about 275-325 hp.

www.summitracing.com
www.northernautoparts.com

Hope this helps.

Moe

 

[MaineShark]

It's not necessary, but I don't think it costs much more than building a 355.

And it will definitely have a more aggressive torque output, due to the longer stroke

Joe

 

[brew]

Joe and Moe
Thanks for the information, That does help a lot. I did find the 383 balanced kit in Summit, They are just up the road from me. I would do all the building my self, but I would have the machine work done at the shop, I have built several engines but only to stock specs, except my 383 Plymouth, How reliable is the 350 with a 2400 coverter?? I wont this to be a touring car taking short and loner trips. I rebuilt the front end with all new bushing and tie rod ends. The rear end will be replaced with a 308 gears, I have a 370 rear in it now, 3600 RPMs at 70 MPH, that is just not good on the road , That is just about 12 MPG, about 8MPG in town, So with 308s and more HP and Torque I figured I would get better milage and about 2200 to 2500 RPM at 70 MPH would be a little better.
Thanks Again
Brew

 

[MaineShark]

I don't think that the stall of the converter will really affect reliability, significantly. In either case, you could replace the converter with a higher-stall unit, for a greater "fun factor." The stall of the converter should be matched to the powerband of the engine. I'm not sure what the exact relationship is, but any good cam manufacturer can help you match the cam and converter stall. Just be aware that higher stall means more heat, so don't go too hight. 2400 would be good, but 3000 would be a bit excessive for most street use.

I also think that, if you're re-gearing it to taller gears, you should put even more "points" on the side of the 383. It's greater torque will help to offset the gear change's drop in percieved torque.

P.S., the gear change, if you have stock tires (225/70R15 or 255/60R15), should put you at 2600 at 65mph, I believe)

Joe

 

[AKRAY4PLAY]

Brew,
if you build the 383 make sure you run the internal balanced crank and have the whole rotating assembly re-balanced at the machine shop. most of these kits are slam together prefabbed stuff and balancing is not very important to the manufacturer. you can run a two bolt main with studs safely to 5500 rpm, and short pulls to 6200ish as long as you have a good balance job. you will need pistons, wrist pins, rings, crank, rods, flexplate and harmonic balancer for a real balance job. good heads are the key to making power. you can get a set of aluminums from AFR, Edelbrock, Dart, Brodix, etc. they differ in price and in performance. so you get what you pay for mostly. the AFR's offer the best bang for the buck in my opinion. a set of 195 AFR's will work wonders on a 383, just look in the archive files for Fred's (fc3) retro 383 build-up. he put together one very nice motor and documented it on the forum. it may give you some more insight to your project. Fred is also running 3.08 gears and seems to love his new set-up. post any more questions you have, the only dumb question is an unasked one! Brian