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How strong are stock pistons and rods ?

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tscott9330

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how trong are stock pistons and rods ?

I am currently rebuilding my 78 350. I want to put it at about 400 HP. If i use the stock pistons and connecting rods, will they stand up to the beating.

If not, what type of slugs and connecting rods have some of you put in your 350?

Tom Scott
 
Tom, I cant really answer that question...but, id select pistons and rods that have a bit more rating than what youre going to be ending up with. I recently had a complete rebuild done on my BB , and i went overboard and got Manley Rods rated at 800 h.p. and SpeedPro Forged Pistons . I figured , at the rate i drive my Vette (2500 miles per year), i may as well spend a little extra money and get very nice internals since it wont need rebuilding again for ions of time. One thing that i would highly recommend , is, using Total Seal Ring Sets with the gapless 2nd ; it completely cured my cranks rear main seal from leaking and i get absolutely no oil film around my PCV grommet like i used to (thus, very little or no blowby)...not to mention better compression.

Dave
 
Re: how trong are stock pistons and rods ?

tscott9330 said:
I am currently rebuilding my 78 350. I want to put it at about 400 HP. If i use the stock pistons and connecting rods, will they stand up to the beating.

If not, what type of slugs and connecting rods have some of you put in your 350?

Tom Scott

Like Dave, kinda hard to answer with no info on how you intend to achieve 400hp. What rpm they're gonna see/live at is as important a consideration as hp. I'm approaching 375hp w/ bushed gm pink rods & speedpro hyper pistons making 388" w/ stroker crank ... carb only ... street only ... on 6.2Krpm chip ... it's a very reliable, low-stress motor. Dunno if you have a budget? ... if there's a limit, that should be the first thing established ... then go from there. If NO nitrous/turbo/super ... then the stock rods (with NEW arp bolts) will do for street use ... but you'll have a tough time achieving 400hp with stock (low CR) pistons. By the time you have the stock rods fitted with new bolts & rods resized, you'll have over $100 in them. There are some pretty good hi-po rods available new under $300/set ... and (if you know what you're doing & looking at) less at ebay & swap meets. Hyper not recommended for much nitrous. Hyper 350 flattops $125-$250/set ... forged $225 & up/set.
JACK:gap
 
I would be happy with 375 hp. I plan to stay away from power adders for the time being. My plan is to put in a efi system from edelbrock, a new cam, and a new set of heads. I would not be opposed to a new set of pistons but i dont want to go over board on the compression, i want this to be my daily driver, I would like to keep it below 10:1. This is my first engine build and i'm open to comments and suggestions. I think with these parts i could at least get to 350 hp. If anyone has any good ideas that would keep with a relatively low budget.

Also, will the stock 78 crank hold up to the abuse. I will of course take it to the strip a few times.

Tom Scott
 
Tom,

One thing i would do if i were you , is, get an untame cam in there. That is alot of bang for the money spent. In my BB, i went from a tame hydr. tappet cam 274 adv. dur./ .517/.529 lift / 114 lsa .... to a Hydr. Roller Cam 304 adv. dur. / .595 lift / 112 lsa with Roller Lifters. Ill bet picked up a good 40 h.p from that alone and it still idles nice (cause i got the crank balanced well and got a FLuidDamper). I think the Lunati Roller Cam was $260 and the Roller LIfters were $430 -- its a very reliable and bullet proof valvetrain now.

Dave
 
Re: how trong are stock pistons and rods ?

tscott9330 said:
.......will they stand up to the beating?

Tom Scott

Granted, this is from a big block, but it's a good example of what can happen to stock parts when you make lots of horsepower.

OUCH
 
nice picture. been there, done that. i have built 350's with cast crank's, cast pistons and stock rods, 2 bolt mains, that dynoed 380 hp at the flywheel . granted these were new parts except for the block. we ran these motors for 2 seasons. when tore down they were fine, could have went another season with no problems. they made an average of about 60 to 80 laps a night on a 1/2 mile track. 2 nites a week, sometimes 3. never under 3500, and running 7200 on the top end before the corner. we never lost a motor in 4 years of racing. tore the hell out of everything else. stock heads, aftermarket springs and rockers, molly pushrods, solid cam. the pistons were 4 relief flat tops, comp was about 10 to 1. if you do this becareful on the amount of total timing you give the motor. with a wild cam and too much timing, it will load the cylinders and push the webbing out of the block. a 2bolt will not take the cylinder pressure a 4bolt will. its important to match the cam to the flow rate of the carb, heads, intake, and exhaust. if it is all working together you can optomize (sp?) the motor's potential. if one part of the combination is wrong that will be the choke point. in my opi yes you can do what you are trying to do and get it to live if you match the parts and tune it right. start adding nitros, or a turbo etc... and all this goes out the window. cylinder pressure will be the key to life for a cast motor. this is all just my opi hope it helps, cheers robert
 
A couple of weeks ago I saw a link to a series of articles on how much a stock low performance 350 would take. One of the Chevy performance magazines, took a high mileage junkyard 350 and set it on a dyno. They replaced the head gaskets and used new head ARP head bolts (I think), a high performance cam and a few other performance parts. Then they started push NOS into the engine. I can't remember exactly how far they went, but it was about 2 times as much as I thought the engine could take.
The thing that stopped the test was a mistake that flooded the engine with a big slug of NOS. It basically disentegrated the top of one piston down to the compression ring. The engine continued to run even after this and still put up some pretty good numbers.
The bottom end and the rest of the engine was not harmed.
I'll look for the article and post a link if I can find it.

Here's the link!
http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/148_0303_n20
 
WOW that was a great article. I had no idea that a stock mouse could put up those kind of numbers. I think compare to that my engine will last forever.

I appreciate all the suggestions guys and i will take them all to heart. I am very confident about my budget buil.

I'll keep you all posted with pictures and stories

Tom Scott
 
well im like robert,ive built circle track motors with a 355 stock pistons rods crank,only had main studs,ran a 1/3 mile oval track 6800 rpm for 50-100 laps a saturday night all year,just need freshened up at the end of the year still using same parts except for rings and bearings.
 
Nobody has mentioned whether the stock engine is an L48 or an L82. The crank, rods, and pistons are completely different!
 
That is a good point page. The engine i'm working with is an L48. What kind of dinference is that gonna make?
 
The L48 block has 2 bolt mains. The crank is cast, and I think the pistons are, too. I'm not an expert, but I'd also be concerned about longevity. How many miles does the current engine have?

Have you considered a ZZ4 crate engine? A lot of people say that with engines like these available, rebuilding/building up isn't worth it...
 
if your not going crazy 2 bolt blocks are fine,i ran my 327 2 bolt cast crank stock rods to over 7000 at the track and was a street motor for 2 years straight,before i broke a rod,crank and bearings were fine.my 360 tpi ,zz4 roller cam with 150 shot of nitrous is 2 bolt main block,cast crank.
 
SMokeHouse,

I enjoyed that article also. This is a testimony to the (virtual) indestructibility of the Chevy 350 .

Im wondering if there are any articles on injecting various type power boosters, other than Nitrous ?? What other chemicals can be injected thru solenoids to increase h.p./tq ... and how do they compare to Nitrous ?

Dave
 
Ive seen propane injected.they use it alot on diesels for towing campers and stuff,now ive seen them running it with nitrous as an added boost.
 

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