Suggestion to GM-Performance Option-

[OLDGOAT]

My plan is to become a C6 owner in mid to late 2005. Maybe I get an '05 and maybe an '06. Naturally I am thinking about factory options and aftermarket performance mods. In the option dept. my choices have settled on Z51 and 1sa.

In the aftermarket mods dept. I am looking at intake and exhaust enhancement. So far, and the numbers are not firm yet from suppliers, it looks like 5-10hp from muffler only replacement and perhaps 10-15hp with cat back larger pipes and new mufflers etc. I lean strongly to the proprietary design of CORSA. They have yet to commit to actual hp gain numbers. This is $1200 to $1500.

On the intake side I have looked at products from breathless performance. This mod claims significant flow enhancement, less restriction etc. but no hp numbers yet. It's $900 or so. Looking at the big flow increases perhaps another conservative 5-10hp. can come from this simple mod.

Together enhanced breathing and exhaust might create some synergy that would provide as much as a conservative 25hp. 100 bucks a hp? OK, I'd buy that.

For my purposes the C6 engine is fine as is. I am planning no mods except enhancements to intake and exhaust.

So here's my suggestion GM. Why not package these simple enhancements as a factory option? You could add a Corsa cat back system and different air induction location and plumbing as in the breathless system.

What will cost me up to $2500 plus shipping to add to my C6 would not cost GM nearly that much as an incremental improvement over the base hardware. So this package could be offered at the same price as Z51...around $1500.

I'll grant you that Corsa technology is unique and more expensive by far to produce than the already decent stock mufflers. On the intake side it looks like a bit more plastic or carbon fiber but labor to install should be identical. How can the parts be that much more expensive?

The factory package might even include a bit of tweaking of the engine control system in consideration of significantly cooler and less restricted intake air and less restrictive exhaust. This would solidify the 25hp. ( or more ) the package would deliver.

Or.....and getting really bold here.....combine the Z51 with the intake/exhaust upgrade package to produce a separate performance package ( and maybe reward those who check the box with a unique little emblem of some sort? Being an oldgoat I really like "SS")

Owners who want these upgrades can do them on their own now. However, having it be "factory" has a serious appeal to me anyway. I expect that there would still remain serious performance mods for those who with to tinker with the innards/and or computer control of their engines.

What's an oldgoat know anyway? I'm used to having my head under the hood of big block Camaros. Back then it was the same song as mine today: Intake and exhaust....that's where you'll get the least expensive and quickest boost in performance. How about it general?

 

[redvett]

What you propose cannot be done in mass production. If it could you would see more options available. It a cost v/s profit thing.

 

[Hib Halverson]

I think you're going to find that, when tested under controlled and credible conditions, your anticipation of 25hp via cat-back and air box will be optmistic. Expect 15hp (maybe 20, if GM really screwed up its development work, which seems unlikely), SAE corrected at the wheels.

 

[OLDGOAT]

Hib, yes, I agree I'm being optimistic on the expected increase ( tracking with the ever optimistic aftermarket suppliers) . The reason I would not tamper with the engine is that I agree with you that for reliability and performance it's very well optimized as is-the current pinnacle of smallblock evolution in fact.

I notice that the aftermarket folks talk a lot about "bench flow measurements" or something similar to indicate improvement. Clearly, a 60% or greater improvement in cold flow through a muffler or similar increase in intake airflow under artificial conditions sounds large. However, what this will translate into at the wheels when added to an already fine tuned system is another matter entirely.

Perhaps this is the reason some aftermarket suppliers are a bit slow to publish actual hp gains?

Still, perhaps for sound alone, I may go for a set of Corsa mufflers but first I'll give the factory set up a fair chance to please.

 

[Edmond]

I always wished they would do the same thing that you ask of and even go further with a set of long tube headers as an option.

GM could buy in mass quantities and not just for the y bodied cars but other lines as well. GM definitely needs something like Ford's SVT or Dodge's SRT line.

 

[OLDGOAT]

Hey Edmond, I seem to recall way back in the late sixties that GM would ship custom tube headers for the Camaro Z-28 IN THE TRUNK. I don't recall if the factory installed the dual 4 barrel option or not on the 302. Back then GM watched the weight to hp on its "passenger cars" and would allow highest performance only on the vette. When I got my first 1968 396 Camaro the first thing I did was take it to a muffler shop and have the enormous rear "cross flow" muffler removed and two proper inline mufflers installed. The 350hp rat motor felt like it picked up at least 50hp! I thought of this experience the first time I saw photos of the ridiculous muffler setup on the C5. 'Course, the C6 thankfully fixed this obvious shortcoming.

I believe that this "mild performance" option of intake and exhaust enhancements could potentially sell thousands of units thus making it economically viable.

 

[Edmond]

They used to offer various engines in the Corvette's. These days, it would never happen. The bean counters wouldn't let it happen.

I can understand that because of the various costs of different engines and the transmissions that would have to come with them. So how about a factory installed supercharger?

 

[Terry Holtz]

I think you're being optimistic on HP gains as well. Here's the experiance of another forum member on some mods to his c-5:

>>>>>>>>>Headers, Vararam and vortex air bridge installed on Thursday. I put my 04 on the dyno this morning. Not what I expected. My first pull last week was 313.37 rwhp with 330.45 ft. lb.s of torque.
With the headers, Vararam and Vortex air bridge it was 321.48 rwhp with 337.72 ft lbs of torque.<<<<<

I'm guessing with the more straight back exhaust design of the c-6, after market exhaust systems will mostly offer better sound.

 

[Tom73]

So here's my suggestion GM. Why not package these simple enhancements as a factory option? You could add a Corsa cat back system and different air induction location and plumbing as in the breathless system.

What will cost me up to $2500 plus shipping to add to my C6 would not cost GM nearly that much as an incremental improvement over the base hardware. So this package could be offered at the same price as Z51...around $1500.

I'll grant you that Corsa technology is unique and more expensive by far to produce than the already decent stock mufflers. On the intake side it looks like a bit more plastic or carbon fiber but labor to install should be identical. How can the parts be that much more expensive?

The factory package might even include a bit of tweaking of the engine control system in consideration of significantly cooler and less restricted intake air and less restrictive exhaust.

Or.....and getting really bold here.....combine the Z51 with the intake/exhaust upgrade package to produce a separate performance package ( and maybe reward those who check the box with a unique little emblem of some sort? Being an oldgoat I really like "SS")

Owners who want these upgrades can do them on their own now. However, having it be "factory" has a serious appeal to me anyway. I expect that there would still remain serious performance mods for those who with to tinker with the innards/and or computer control of their engines.

One cost that you need to factor in is the EPA certification of this "new" engine. This is a very expensive process. That is why we never have more than two engine options any more. Makes you long for the '69 model with its choice of seven engines and two displacements.

As it is Chevy/GM does not want to spend the bucks for a modest increase in power. Thay would rather put that money into something that they get more bang for the buck like the Z06.

tom...

 

[c4c5specialist]

HI there,
Right now, Corsa is a GM certified performance exhaust. It has been sold for a while by GM parts departments.
All GM crate engines are installed meeting NO EPA certifications, unless the engine was the original engine installed when produced.
Even the Ram Jet series, with harness and computer is NOT EPA, because noone purchasing these engines really cares about it.
When testing for EPA, the actual vehicle must be outfitted exactly to the specs that they have, then it will get certification. IF you change anything relating to how the engine is running, the certification is void, unless you have CARB numbers or EPA legal numbers.
As for the rest, when exhaust mufflers are installed on c6, barely 5 horse will be found.
As for intake, maybe another 5.
Yes, this engine breathes that good.
Allthebest, c4c5