Bushing Debate

[maxrevs85]

OOOOOH ,IHATE THAT WHEN THAT HAPPENS:L

 

[69MyWay]

No worries Heidi,

Since your springs, sway bars (size), and frame (no cross bracing) is staying stock, you won't have any problems.

My 69 is quiet and smooth, and my 90 is also quiet and smooth with the new poly bushings.

I also did this conversion on my V8 Fiero. It did squeek for about the first 500 miles, then got quiet, was smooth, and gave no other problems as mentioned above.

You have to raise the car high enough to swing the lower control arm all the way down to drop the front coil springs and remove the control arms.

I am sure you could remove all the suspension parts and carry them to a local shop that has a press and have them swap the parts out.

Many people whip out the old propane torch and just cook the old bushings out of the parts, then chisel the outer metal bezel out. You can also use a drill motor, drill all through the rubber part of the bushing, then finger push it out. You will then have to at least hack saw the outer bezel and then chisel it on out. You will see what I mean when you get these out.

If you check with Mid America, they sell a tool for the rear control arm bushing. You will find these quite worn when you get the originals out. This is where the rear trailing arm mounts to the pocket in the frame.

 

[Jack]

Re: Where were you yesterday!

Gads Hib! It looks like I should have gone with rubber!

I like the ride in my 78 now. I have a bad hip, and I think a rougher ride would reduce my driving enjoyment.

Opinions on how much rougher poly will be compared with stock rubber?
Opinions on squeaks at a later date?

I can always send it back and get rubber, but I need to decide before they arrive and I mangle the box to oogle.
I really just want to install and go. Forever. (20 years would be nice)
Heidi:

Heidi:
For the time being I'm pleased with poly in front & delrin in rear struts.

Suspension R&R is a tough, dirty job. I did mine by myself ... I'd probably do it again. Took me several LONG days and there were a few suprises and MANY "Oh Schlitz!" & I don't mean brewski. My nearly 50-year-old arms, legs, neck & back ached during & for days afterward.

Rubber is not for everyone ... nor polyurethane nor Delrin nor aluminum nor steel.

But rubber may be best choice for your hip.

Keep the motor oil, engine degreaser and other petrochemicals away from the rubber & it'll probably last as long as you require.
JACK:gap

 

[smurfvet]

Heidi,

When I had mine done, I had a mechanic I trusted do it. 69myway is correct, the front end needs alignment when you're finished. Between the pullers, press and alignment system, it takes more stuff than I've got in my barn!

 

[Hib Halverson]

Re: Where were you yesterday!

Gads Hib! It looks like I should have gone with rubber!

Perhaps, but again, it depends on the car's intended use and the sensitivity of the driver.

I like the ride in my 78 now. I have a bad hip, and I think a rougher ride would reduce my driving enjoyment.

Low frequency ride movement, which is most likely to bother a damaged hip, is not going to change much. What changes with urethane, or any bushing that is less compliant that stock, is your mid-to-high-frequency (such as chatter bumps, ripple strips, rail crossings at speed, Bots dots, slab joints on concrete roads, tar strips, and etc.) ride movements. The higher the frequency of the movement and the more abrupt it comes, the more noticeable the difference between rubber and urethane will be.

Opinions on how much rougher poly will be compared with stock rubber?

Whoa, girl...you're asking a very tough question, if you want an objective answer. Let me take a shot. The difference between rubber and urethane will be most noticeable over high-frequency ride movements or "impact harshness". The difference will range from noticeable to downright annoying depending on the impact and how sensitive you are. When I say noticeable, I mean you'll feel and hear the harshness.

Opinions on squeaks at a later date?

If you don't use graphite-impregnated urethane and you don't periodically disassemble and grease them with the greases that urethane bushing makers supply, I'd expect them within a year...sooner if the car is operated on cold/wet weather, if the bushings are installed improperly or if the bushings are made with low-quality materials. Even the graphite bushings may squeak in cold/wet weather. Whether or not the bushings squeak depends on a lot of factors. Some, but not all are: type of urethane, manufacturing technique, installation technique, vehicle weight, amount of bushing rotation and the force vectors of the loads on the suspension.

I can always send it back and get rubber, but I need to decide before they arrive and I mangle the box to oogle.
I really just want to install and go. Forever. (20 years would be nice)
Heidi

Well, if you don't mind the impact harshness increase and you're willing to risk the squeaking, I'd say go for it. The plus of urethane is slightly-to-moderately (it depends on the condition of the old bushings) improved handling at the car's absolute limit. If you don't drive at the limit, then there are relatively few advantages to polyurethane over good quality, OE-type rubber bushings. Lastly, let me state if the purpose of the bushings is to improve handling on an otherwise stock C3 chassis, there are a heck of a lot of other modifications you need to make first, before you go to poly bushings.

 

[78SilvAnniv]

long term

Not interested in improving handling. She handles just fine for the way I drive.

My choice selection was based on longevity. I thought the poly would outlast rubber and oil leaks. It does not sound like the bumps, tracks and things will be much of a problem as I slow down like a snail for them. When I know they're there.

I think I made my hip problem out to be worse than it actually is. On my good days, I can handle nearly anything. On my bad days, EVERYTHING is going to bother it.
So, I think I'm safe with the VB&P poly kit.

Thanks everyone for the advice, insight and comments!
Heidi

Anyone have fillings in their molars and accidentally bit on a piece of tinfoil? That jolt is what I feel everytime I take a step and put weight on the bad hip on my bad days. The not so bad days it just throbs, aches and feels 'jumpy'. The good days stay good if I don't sit or walk too long on hard surfaces.
I can accurately predict weather changes, too.

 

[Stallion]

I was actually just reading about bushings in my book, but I'm not sure I totally understand their use and functionality. The bushings are soft and flexible parts that are in-between other parts such as washers and bolts, etc., right?

Newton was also talking about the different materials and their affect on the car with handling and cornering.

Thanks!

TR

 

[78SilvAnniv]

Think of bushings this way...

They are the cushion between moving joints, like cartilage in your elbows and knees...
Heidi

 

[Stallion]

Okay, that's what I figured. Thanks, Heidi!

TR