Driving

[jwawhite]

Was looking at some You Tube Videos about wrecks in performance vehicles by inexperienced drivers..

Got to thinking about the button for Traction Control. Obviously some of these drivers either turned it off or the vehicle did not have this control option.

What causes the vehicle to swerve one direction only to pop back in the opposite direction leading to an accident. Why couldn't the driver pull it out after the first swerve? One video of a 'Vette traveling on a mountain road appeared to
to downshift possibly 4th to 1st by accident instead of 3rd which spun his car around, seen that one?

It kinda reminds me of a high side on a motorcycle, the rider is about to lose control and then slammed over the bars vs a low side where-in the bike gently lays down, if you're lucky.

I am driving a somewhat powerful car--yes it's only a 350 but still. I drive conservatively but how good is this Traction Control, can it get me out of a jam if I am losing control or does
it preven me from getting into trouble?

 

[BoDuke]

Here's what I've noticed with my C5 compared to my other cars...'82 Camaro Z-28, 305/auto, BFG 215/60's, I could drift this car any time, anywhere, dry roads or wet, gravel or pavement, very very controllable. My '69 Charger, 440, 727 auto with stall, cammed, geared, and carb'd, built for the strip, BFG 225/50's. I could get this thing to do whatever I wanted, whenever, however, from a dead stop or at speed, dry road, gravel, etc (got the videos ), smooth as glass.

Now then, the Vette, 2004, stock 350, auto, GY F1 tires...I've only got it sideways once just to 'give it a go' to get a feel for it. What I found with mine is, being fuel injected compared to carbeurated (I know thats spelled wrong), the throttle doesnt have the play and forgiveness that my others did. The Camaro and Charger were relatively easy to control with the throttle while drifting. I could feather those cars and maintain the slide. The BFG skins didn't grab the pavement as hard as these F1's though either. The Vette, the instant I back out of it, the car shoots straight in the direction it's pointing, and it doesn't ask twice. The Vette's steering is incredibly tight making over steer way to easy, unfortunately. Using the correct amount of throttle with just the right amount of steering, the Vette is going to be A LOT of fun! This F1 rubber my C5 sits on grabs the road like nothing I've ever seen. I can't believe how this thing handles curves and fast turns, its absolutely nuts!!

Reference your question about the car whipping about, a lot of 'non drivers' (those are the Harry-Hot-Rodders that think they can drive) think that they have to flat foot it every where.They dont have the common sense to use throttle and steering in proper ratio with one another. They hammer the throttle, the back tires break loose and get squirrely, and the 1st thing they do is panic and release the throttle, usually when the ass end is coming back around. Thus, the car whips around suddenly, grabs the concrete (usually when the car is facing the ditch or median), and off they go in to the wild blue yonder wondering wth just happened. :confused

Traction Control...what I've noticed, when I rail on mine either to drift around a corner or from a dead stop, it seems like it cuts the fuel to the motor. I'm not sure if that's what it does on the C5, but that's what it feels like. My Cadillac (95 and 2000 Deville's) would both cut the fuel, kick the accelerator back at your foot, and apply a certain amount of brake to the wheels pending on the speed) It is designed to keep the wheels from spinning.

This is my experience. I'm not an expert by any means on driving a Vette as I've only had mine a couple months. I just wanted to share the handling characteristics of my C5 compared to my Camaro and Charger. I'm gonna have to 'learn' how to guide the Vette through its paces, I'm SO looking forward to it!

 

[timfitz63]

I'm thinking "Bo's" got it partly right. These folks don't expect the back end to 'break loose,' which is far easier to do in this car than the average driver seems to think. These cars are very light and put a lot of torque to the rear wheels. When the rear wheels start spinning, one has effectively put Mr. Newton in the driver's seat... And if one is turning the front wheels at the same time, the car will try to swap ends... In my opinion, for people who are not enthusiast drivers, traction control largely provides a false sense of security (i.e., "I can do whatever I want with the car -- mash down the accelerator, slam on the brakes -- 'cause traction control will keep me safe"). Something people should be keeping in mind with a high performance car equipped with a lot of these kinds of techno-gadgets: traction control only works when the tires have traction; if they're spinning freely because the back end has broken loose, guess what...? For all intents and purposes, you ain't go no traction -- or traction control...

Next, they panic when the back end unexpectedly swings around, abruptly come off the throttle, and as "Bo" pointed out, the car suddenly regains traction and swings back the other direction (due to any counter-steer introduced by the startled driver); the driver ends up in the automotive equivalent of a PIO and an accident ensues... Or, they don't realize that when the TCS does kick in and partially reduces the throttle and/or applies rear braking to arrest the wheel spin, that the car is still going to do whatever it's being commanded to do. In other words, if the driver still has his foot mashed down on the accelerator because he's frozen with panic (or is just expecting the TCS to do everything for him), the car suddenly regains traction, lurches forward (throttle is still largely open because of the driver's foot position on the pedal), and the next thing the driver knows, he's in the weeds or a against a Jersey wall...

As you surmised, about the only thing traction control helps with is keeping one pointed straight by limiting wheel spin. But one has to realize the inherent limitations of the technology -- and above all, keep driving the car as if one doesn't have all these 'nanny' gadgets standing watch over the driver...

 

[LLC5]

Was looking at some You Tube Videos about wrecks in performance vehicles by inexperienced drivers..

Got to thinking about the button for Traction Control. Obviously some of these drivers either turned it off or the vehicle did not have this control option.

What causes the vehicle to swerve one direction only to pop back in the opposite direction leading to an accident. Why couldn't the driver pull it out after the first swerve? One video of a 'Vette traveling on a mountain road appeared to
to downshift possibly 4th to 1st by accident instead of 3rd which spun his car around, seen that one?

It kinda reminds me of a high side on a motorcycle, the rider is about to lose control and then slammed over the bars vs a low side where-in the bike gently lays down, if you're lucky.

I am driving a somewhat powerful car--yes it's only a 350 but still. I drive conservatively but how good is this Traction Control, can it get me out of a jam if I am losing control or does
it preven me from getting into trouble?

It is not traction control that is keeping the vehicle from spinning, or spinning out of control, it is active handling that does that. Active handling controls individual brake calipers to bring the vehicle back in line using multiple sensors, including yaw and steering wheel sensors. Traction control stabilizes the drive wheels from losing traction through the use of throttle plate angle, timing control, and brake caliper application. Both traction control and active handling use the anti lock brake system to modulate the individual caliper operation. Some manufacturers are now using individual caliper actuation to distribute power from one side of an open differential to the other side, claiming it acts like a limited slip or compter controlled locking differential, which is stretching the truth quite a bit but it is significantly cheaper than the real thing. Hope this helps.