Match #'s

[ramrod]

Here is a question that should stimulate some comment ...yesterday I was speaking with a fellow who was selling a 1963 Vette Convertible ...I asked what I thought was the simple question " ...is this a matching #'s car ..." ....his response was " ....thats meaningless ...."!

Well, to me it IS meaningful ....I had always assumed that a matching #'s car implied ( among other things ) that the ORIGINAL engine block and heads were original and that the numbers(s) on the block could, somehow, be matched to that specific vehicle ( versus class of vehicles ....like all 63' convertibles )

Anyhow, the fellow told me that a block # CANNOT be matched to the specific vehicle ...he said that there are folks that will drop in a CORRECT engine for you and then MAKE the # match ...

Now I'm confused ....can anyone shed some light here ?

Thanks

 

[8388]

To a collector, #'s matching is very important since it tends to have alot to do with market value, and ultimately how much one should pay for the vehicle.

Blocks and heads have *casting * marks and #'s that identify them to a particular year. Back in the 60's the tooling that were used at the factory to *stamp* the serial number on a blocks were simple, as a result it's easy to duplicate them if one has the proper tools. That's why today the shape of the #'s are computer generated and thus are much harder to duplicate.

 

[ramrod]

Yes ...but back to my original question ...can a particular block/set of heads be specifically matched to a specific car ( frame ) - in other words, is the something akin to a vehicle VIN on the blocks/heads ....I am curious about early/mid 60's cards and
more recent C4's.

Thanks.

 

[paintdaddy]

I dont think GM matched engines with bodys until the late 60s but Im not sure.And yes there are a couple of places that will sell you a "restoration "engine and they will stamp it to match your vin.I looked into this for my 68 but decided against it.

 

[muddywaters]

Match#'s

A friend of mine worked at one of the better engine shops in the area and have heard this from other lads that work on vette's, that you can have any #'s you want.

 

[Tom73]

The engine in a Vette has numbers on it to identify it to a specific car. In fact, all cars are like that. For the vette there is a stamp pad machined on the block in front of the passanger side head (at least through '91. Not sure about the Gen II LT1 or the Gen II LS1.) On this pad is two sets of numbers that are stamped. One is the engine usage code and will look like "F0217ABC". F is for the Flint engine plant were the Vette engines were built. 0217 is the engine assembly date, Feb 17. ABC is the suffix for the horsepower/transmission/emission of that specific engine. This number is stamped on the engine at the engine plant. The other number is the VIN deritive. It will look something like 1S400001 where the last 5 or 6 digits match the VIN of the car it is installed in. (The use of the VIN on the stamp pad started during the 1960 model run.) This number is stamped on the vehicle assembly line. Since the numbers are stamped at two different plants they will look different since different stamps were used.

But you can create a "matching numbers" engine. First find a block with the correct casting # and casting date (within six months prior to the cars build date). Deck the block to remove all the stamped numbers. Then restamp the numbers that you want on the block. To do it right you must know the size and font of the stamps originaly used. Also the decking of the block can be an issue. Most all engine machine shops use a rotary decker that removes material in a rotary fashion. This will leave broach marks that run at angles across the surface. The factory used a decking machine that was like a huge planner and it removed material front to back leaving broach marks that run front/rear, not at an angle. So if you can create the correct broach marks and find the correct (size/font) stamps, you can create a forgery.

So for the short answer, Yes the engines are number matched to the car they are installed in. And, Yes a "numbers matching" engine can be created (but is not easy to do).

tom...