Renegade Intake

[nelson84]

I might have missed it, but I've seen nothing but anecdotal "evidence." on any board or forum. I'm almost certain that of the Renegades sold, one must have seen a dyno - even by accident. How do people that do major work like intake replacement fail to due their homework on a dyno? I know that driveability is the most important thing to some, but c'mon. If anyone has seen hard data, I'd like to know. Failing that, it's all a fairytale - to me.

I think there is some data on the crossfire injection forum.

 

[vetteoz]

I think there is some data on the crossfire injection forum.

There is but the guy is starting with a worked over engine ;
H/C, exhaust ,3.73 rear so no good for stock CFI comparison

 

[vetteoz]

How do people that do major work like intake replacement fail to due their homework on a dyno?

As has been noted elsewhere;
CFI owners are so happy to have a performance increase they don't care what it did before and their Butt-O- Meter tells them all they want to know

If anyone has seen hard data, I'd like to know. Failing that, it's all a fairytale - to me.

Some guys over on C4 Guru are trying to get some pennies together to buy a car and do the before / after stuff to put a end to all the BS
regarding the Renegade

 

[vetteboy86]

I have the stock heads, when I installed the renegade it was sluggish at first, but once I corrected the timing and bumped the fuel pressure it went pretty good. From my experience timing of the engine makes a huge difference. I just slapped the intake on and bolted down the TB's and it ran like a dog until I reset the timing, the timing was way off. The renegade is a good little piece. The stock crossfire has the swirl deals below the TB's and the renegade does not use them. I am not sure why GM put them on they don't do anything, they are supposedly meant to disperse the fuel arand the inside of the intake but I think it is BS. I would like to put lower gears in the crossfire but I am spending my money on another project.

I suspect that if you would have adjusted the timing on your car before the renegade install you would have noticed a difference.

 

[nelson84]

I suspect that if you would have adjusted the timing on your car before the renegade install you would have noticed a difference.

When you pull an intake off your timing will be way off from before. Timing has to be reset because you have moved the distributor from its original position.

Just a little intake 101 for you.

 

[XLR8]

When you pull an intake off your timing will be way off from before. Timing has to be reset because you have moved the distributor from its original position.

Just a little intake 101 for you.

Nelson - are you being deliberately obtuse?

He didn't imply that timing adjustments wouldn't be necessary after you replaced your intake. He suggested you could have acheived a similar seat of the pants difference if you had adjusted the timing PRIOR to the installation of the magical Renegade.

It would have impressed your audience more by demonstrating an organized and methodical collection of data to backup your claims.

Just a little performance proving 101 for you.

Jane Ann

 

[Hib Halverson]

I have the stock heads, when I installed the renegade it was sluggish at first, but once I corrected the timing and bumped the fuel pressure it went pretty good. From my experience timing of the engine makes a huge difference. I just slapped the intake on and bolted down the TB's and it ran like a dog until I reset the timing, the timing was way off. The renegade is a good little piece. The stock crossfire has the swirl deals below the TB's and the renegade does not use them. I am not sure why GM put them on they don't do anything, they are supposedly meant to disperse the fuel arand the inside of the intake but I think it is BS. I would like to put lower gears in the crossfire but I am spending my money on another project.

"nelson84", I've asked here twice now and on other threads you've begun on the Renegade for objective data.

Do you have any objective test data on that intake manifold? I hope you'll man-up and answer that question directly instead of posting all the smoke and mirrors B.S.

As for the "swirl deals" (), GM found during early development of the 2xTBI low cross ram manifold that were was a flow velocity problem at low rpms and at tip in. The vanes in the floor of the intake are designed to cause swirl such that atomized fuel will be less likely to condense out of the charge air and puddle on the floor of the manifold.

 

[WhalePirot]

round and round....

No resolution.

I wonder if this will ever die. At least talk of Lindsay and Charlie will go the way of OJ, sooner or later.

I urge this thread to follow.

 

[vetteboy86]

When you pull an intake off your timing will be way off from before. Timing has to be reset because you have moved the distributor from its original position.

Just a little intake 101 for you.

What was your timing set to before the swap and what is it after? Also, the same goes for fp?

Look, this thread isn't going to turn into a pissing contest, rather a learning tool for anyone that stops by to look at it. If someone want's to purchase the renegade based on all talk that is their choice.

Furthermore I see nothing in this thread that supports the purchase of this product with hard facts.

 

[Hib Halverson]

When you pull an intake off your timing will be way off from before. Timing has to be reset because you have moved the distributor from its original position.

Just a little intake 101 for you.

Hate to say it, "nelson84" you're showing a hint of ignorance.

When you remove the distibutor prior to an intake change, the timing will not be "way off" if you know what you are doing...which seems debatable sometimes.

You pull the dist. straight up, as you pull up, because of the helical gears on the cam and distributor shaft, the rotor turns slightly. Once the dist. gear clears the camshaft gear, you mark the position of the rotor on the dist. body.

When you're ready to reinstall it, you set the rotor opposite your mark, push the dist. in place then and the rotor turns back the other way. if the oil pump drive doesn't engage, you turn the motor by hand or bump the starter until it does and viola, the spark timing will be the same as before.

It ain't rocket science, dude.

As for the Renegade well, "nelson84"...you, I and everyone else here knows, it probably make no significant performance change on a stock or near stock engine. If it did, you and every other Renegade buyer would have been all over the forums with dyno data. Now, on a modified engine, there may be some improvement at high rpm but the price you pay for that higher peak torque, is narrowing of the torque curve.

Dispute my prediction with some facts.

 

[nelson84]

What was your timing set to before the swap and what is it after? Also, the same goes for fp?

Look, this thread isn't going to turn into a pissing contest, rather a learning tool for anyone that stops by to look at it. If someone want's to purchase the renegade based on all talk that is their choice.

Furthermore I see nothing in this thread that supports the purchase of this product with hard facts.

My timing and fuel pressure was set at the stock specifications. My fuel pressure wasn't adjustable before the renegade was installed. I didn't see the point to remove the TB's and make them adjustable and then remove them again and reinstall the TB's on the renegade. I purchased a set of DCS worked over TB's off of ebay a few weeks before I recieved my rengade intake. I don't like doing things over and over. How much times does a guy have in a day.

To set things straight, my crossfire was all stock before the renegade install except for the following gimmicky mods:
ADS chip & 180 stat
K&N
random cat(I actually think this mod added a little)
walker rear y-pipe & muffler eliminators
under drive pulleys
air pump delete
throttle performance switch
shift kit

14.9 1/4 mile

Next:

renegade
2" TB's
made fuel pressure adjustable
added a custom painted airbox(must be worth 10 hp)

look at this intake it has to be worth some ponies
I installed it myself, the extra power must be from my precision tuning.