Replacing Carpeting...how difficult?

[Chris Kennedy]

I have now pretty much assembled all I need to get to swap out the worn out gray for a "reconditioned by Chris" black interior in my '89 (ordering the carpeting is the final step). Originally, I intended to have all this stuff "professionally" put in, but I am having a problem with interior shops here in Houston giving me the run around on the costs to do this, full of sighs and heavs as to the difficulties, etc etc etc. I am sick of this whining on what seems to be something these guys should be able to quote and do in their sleep, and am now TEMPTED to do it all myself---yet, before I attempt it I wanted to see if anyone has done this, and how difficult it is. From all my poking around in the car, it appears to be pretty easy, and Mid America rates it a "2" job (their next to most easy) on their rating scale, for whatever that is worth.

Thanks,
/s/ Chris Kennedy
Houston, Texas

 

[JonM]

Its really simple...just a quick remove and replace. If you can handle a screwdriver and a wrench you should have no problem. The only difficult piece, and you may not need to replace it. Is the bolster, its the piece just above the passengers knees. Their are two bolts holding it on that you have to remove from the back...its a bit**. The drivers side is easy. It will take you a while, but its a nice project. Just take your time.

 

[Vettelt193]

pretty easy, but time consuming... like JonM said, if you can handle a screwdriver and wrench, you can do it. Just don't expect to have it done in 30 minutes... plan on an all day or weekend event to really get it all right.

 

[WhalePirot]

Ditto above, unless you have areas that have melted together, as I did, due to the header heat in the footwells.

You might consider sound matting installation as long as the carpet is out, if you have high noise levels that you wish to reduce. Fat Mat is the cheapest at just over $1/sq. ft. It takes about 50 square feet to do a single layer throughout.

 

[Redcoupe864+3]

"Fat Mat"? Have to confess I haven't heard of that one. Where can we get it? Looking at re-doing my interior as well, so anything that cuts down the noise even a bit... Thanks!

 

[Chris Kennedy]

Thanks, everyone. I will do some additional poking around (in the car!) this weekend. I ordered the carpeting late this morning, and will probably start doing things in stages. It's been fun getting and fixing up the used seats I wanted, and I was also fortunate to get used black door panels in pretty good condition, too. Luckily, the top door trim on my existing panels is in excellent shape, so I will simply transfer it to the used panels, which were the only pieces that were a bit rough. The rest of the stuff (various minor trim pieces) was all available new at a decent price, and I found a used black console storage bin top that was in great shape, so I cleaned it up and installed it. The sides of the bin will probably stay gray, as I am hesitant to use trim paint there, they are a complicated piece to change, and really aren't that visible and the colors don't clash. I also splurged and got new GM black seatbelts from Eckler's (safety considerations).

/s/ Chris Kennedy

 

[WhalePirot]

hijack apologies to Chris

"Fat Mat"? I haven't heard of that one. Where can we get it? Looking at re-doing my interior as well.

I found three products, quite similar , with similar sound deadening characteristics, according to their published claims.

Dyna Mat is the best known and costs the most.

Brown Bread is a Canadian product.

Fat Mat is sold on e-Bay, like everything else, including the above two. I bought 2 50 sq.ft. rolls from a guy in the Philly area for $1.29 per.

Local estimate for install of DynaMat was $500.

Sound Deadening Materials
Product Name - -- - - - - - -20C- - 30C $/sq.ft.
Brown Bread --Ultimate ---0.39 0.32 $2.25
Brown Breead -Extreme --- 0.29 0.20
DynaMat -Extreme -----------0.42 0.26 $2.92
FatMat -----------------------------0.35 0.27 $1.29

My analysis used the above speadsheet (which got messed up in the posting). The deadening index varies with the shown temperature.

I triple layered the 'cargo area' and double the rest. Doubling is claimed to treble the effectiveness. I put a bit too kmuch under the privacy screen, as its rolling freedom is resricted. My car is not back on tghe street after this install (rewiring the O/D) so I cannot report on the effectiveness.

The kit I got (no extrea $) included a small packet of white powder, which is likely TSP cleaner, instructions (clean well, dry fully, press hard), and a small roller. The roller had a plastic wheel, which broke half way through the first roll. I have a similar tool for wallpapering, made of oak. The aluminum layer is exposed and is what you press down upon. It is slick (also sharp edged), so many assorted tols could be used to get a good bond bewtween the sticky side and the floorpans. The material stretches some; perhaps 10-15%.

I took a number of photos if you want to see a shiny-silver, naked Vette interior.

 

[Redcoupe864+3]

WhalePirot: Post them there Fat Mat fotos, please! Did some Web research. Intriguing product. Anyone done an on-road evaluation of this or similar sound killers?

 

[WhalePirot]

Post them there Fat Mat fotos.

Working on it.

THe stripped driver's footwell. Notice the burn through from the front Y-pipe, prior to my repair. http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/BareDriver.JPG

The stripped cargo area,with the privided, short-lived tools. I opted to install strips between the ribbing, to smooth the rear area. One is installed here.
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/BareRear.JPG

This is what a roll of FatMat looks like. The small strip shows the reverse side, which has a waxpaper-like sheet that peels off of the sticky side. http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/FatMatRoll.JPG

Three layers of FatMat cover most of the rear. Oops, the two layers under the privacy shade prove too thick to allow it to move freely. http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/FatRear.JPG
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/FattedRear.JPG


Two layers of FatMat installed under the passenger seat.
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/FatPaxSide.JPG

The carpetting was melted to the underlayment and could not be removed without tearing, so it was lifted out of the way and the critical areas were covered. This is the pax side; driver side is similar.
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/fry747/MyVette/FatMat/FatPaxToes.JPG

 

[Redcoupe864+3]

WhalePirot: Thanks! When you're back up & running, please let us know how much of a difference the stuff makes.

 

[AdvancedAutoCC]

I have now pretty much assembled all I need to get to swap out the worn out gray for a "reconditioned by Chris" black interior in my '89 (ordering the carpeting is the final step). Originally, I intended to have all this stuff "professionally" put in, but I am having a problem with interior shops here in Houston giving me the run around on the costs to do this, full of sighs and heavs as to the difficulties, etc etc etc. I am sick of this whining on what seems to be something these guys should be able to quote and do in their sleep, and am now TEMPTED to do it all myself---yet, before I attempt it I wanted to see if anyone has done this, and how difficult it is. From all my poking around in the car, it appears to be pretty easy, and Mid America rates it a "2" job (their next to most easy) on their rating scale, for whatever that is worth.

Thanks,
/s/ Chris Kennedy
Houston, Texas

Hi Chris,
The reason most shops are hesitant to give an "exact" quote is you don't know what you might run into once things are apart. Plus, the plastic pieces are prone to breakage, no matter how careful you are to remove them, as well as frozen screws, etc. etc... Any reputable shop will tell you these kind of things upfront. Myself, I tell EVERY customer straight hourly time, plus incidentals. Some guys like to do things themselves, and I have no problems with it. However, if things are half taken apart, I respectfully decline any work at that point. Good luck, and TAKE YOUR TIME!

 

[Chris Kennedy]

Hi Chris,
The reason most shops are hesitant to give an "exact" quote is you don't know what you might run into once things are apart. Plus, the plastic pieces are prone to breakage, no matter how careful you are to remove them, as well as frozen screws, etc. etc... Any reputable shop will tell you these kind of things upfront. Myself, I tell EVERY customer straight hourly time, plus incidentals. Some guys like to do things themselves, and I have no problems with it. However, if things are half taken apart, I respectfully decline any work at that point. Good luck, and TAKE YOUR TIME!

Thanks! I appreciate the insight from someone in the business. At this point, I have completed fixing up the used seats and am making some repairs to the used door panels. I do know what you mean about broken bits and pieces needing fixing, but nothing so far has been a big deal. My only reservation is that, after working with car repair places for many years, I find myself getting a bit frustrated at the open-ended hourly rate approach to car repair. In my line of work I have had considerable success turnkeying projects. That is, giving a flat price to get the job done---I am a lawyer, and this approach delights many people and brings in business, as it's so unexpected in a profession famous for awful hourly rates. Lots of things today are moving away from what we have gotten used to in the past (e.g., outsourcing etc.), and I feel that auto repair pricing should be one of them. At least I practice what I preach. Besides, as you point out, professional repair shops should have experience in what to expect, and have the various bits and pieces needed to repair the expected problems efficiently. Even I, a lowly clod, knew that screws might be missing etc., and ordered the various repair packages you can get from the COrvette suppliers to cover these contingencies. Personally, I think the hourly rate approach leads many times to wasting of time and delays. One alternative is an hourly rate, but a maximum amount regardless of how long it takes. Sorry for rattling on, but I am sick of the open-ended "hourly rate" mantra which all too often results in our cars being held hostage for long periods of time and some ultimate crazy bill. Nothing will change until people start insisting on changes and voting with their feet if they don't get them.

/s/ Chris Kennedy
Houston, Texas

 

[AdvancedAutoCC]

Keep in mind the word "reputable"

I understand your position on open-ended labor quotes, but the entire problem with the automotive industry is that specialized repair is lumped in with general repair. Not to mention that auto repair has been treated as a commodity rather than a service. The motoring public therefore has the mentality that "service is service, no matter what" and consequently the Wal-Mart way of thinking takes over and they "shop around for the best deal". The result is not always pretty. As with anything, you have your spectrum of price and typically you get what you pay for. Some people use the concept of specialized vehicle repairs to fleece people, while others do not. Scum, as with cream rises to the top as the old saying goes.

This being said, a reputable shop will tell you that yes, it's straight hourly time, but will give a reasonable timeframe so that you have some idea what you'll be paying. This is what I do with any quote that I give. Reputable shops won't play the "lowest price" game either, in part because most don't have to in order to stay in business. Speaking strictly from my personal experience, this is exactly how I conduct my business. If somebody gets stupid or unreasonable, I politely tell them there are several other repair shops that can take care of their needs and for them to go there. What I'm driving at here in this rant is that what is needed is open honest communication (old fashioned "your word is your bond" type stuff) between shop AND customer, rather than menu pricing items ala the large chain operations (no names need be mentioned, but they're riddled with consumer fraud and lawsuits). Our society in general has a lot to do with it these days. I could go on and on, but I think I've made the point here.

 

[Chris Kennedy]

I understand your position on open-ended labor quotes, but the entire problem with the automotive industry is that specialized repair is lumped in with general repair. Not to mention that auto repair has been treated as a commodity rather than a service. The motoring public therefore has the mentality that "service is service, no matter what" and consequently the Wal-Mart way of thinking takes over and they "shop around for the best deal". The result is not always pretty. As with anything, you have your spectrum of price and typically you get what you pay for. Some people use the concept of specialized vehicle repairs to fleece people, while others do not. Scum, as with cream rises to the top as the old saying goes.

This being said, a reputable shop will tell you that yes, it's straight hourly time, but will give a reasonable timeframe so that you have some idea what you'll be paying. This is what I do with any quote that I give. Reputable shops won't play the "lowest price" game either, in part because most don't have to in order to stay in business. Speaking strictly from my personal experience, this is exactly how I conduct my business. If somebody gets stupid or unreasonable, I politely tell them there are several other repair shops that can take care of their needs and for them to go there. What I'm driving at here in this rant is that what is needed is open honest communication (old fashioned "your word is your bond" type stuff) between shop AND customer, rather than menu pricing items ala the large chain operations (no names need be mentioned, but they're riddled with consumer fraud and lawsuits). Our society in general has a lot to do with it these days. I could go on and on, but I think I've made the point here.

Thanks! I certainly understand what you mean about lawsuits and people refusing to take responsibility for their own decisions. It really does prevent many good ideas from taking hold, out of fear of being sued by people who view everything that they don't like as someone else's fault. With so many things changing in consumer services (often for the better) these days, I am waiting for someone to come up with a really good idea about auto repair and pricing. In other words, the repair equivalent of TireRack or Amazon, which have revolutionized the purrchase of their respective goods. I am not sure what this would be, but it seems to require that the tyranny of the old "flat rate" manual pricing, or just hourly rates with no ceiling, has to go for a start. You sound like you run a fine business----you need to open a Houston branch, as this is the scuzziest town for auto repair/services I have ever seen.

/s/ Chris Kennedy
Houston, Texas

 

[Jeroenvgfn]

Nice job Whalepirot,

I am going to use your photo's for my coming carpet replacing.

I do not know about this fat mat but at our local DIY shops we can get isolation material to put on the bare concrete before you place the wooden floorpanels in your house.

this is moist regulating and heat resistant,

If you have more pics please bring em on.

 

[1stC3Vette]

Chris,

I did the complete interior change on my '89 coupe last fall. Went from blue to black and could not be happier. The most difficult part was wrenching seat belts free. The seats were fairly easy.

When I removed any screws or bolts, I placed them in a ziplock lunch bag and wrote what they were for. Then, when I put it back together, everything was labeled. I did buy a interior screw kit and matched up the new screws with what was removed.

The carpet underneath the dash was interesting. I used some 3M spray on adhesive and it worked out fine.

When you free the center console area, you will need to remove a few of the dash faceplate screws. Just keep a note of what was removed and where. I took some digital pics before I removed everything, so I had a good way to make sure it was put back the same way.

You can definately do this yourself. Just take your time and be patient.

Good luck,
Dino

 

[Jeroenvgfn]

Just out of curiousity, I know the C4 is not the model which is matching numbers , collectors bla bla bla like the older models,

why is everyone changing to the black interiour.

I had the doubts myself but took the decission to take the original color again
( Graphite)

I took the sport seatcovers without perforations, hopefully it looks good.

took the interior screw kitt also ( thanks for the hint of making pics before)
can be a mess when you have a pile of parts to put back in the car

will start a fresh thread when the parts arrive to show my efford in C4 restoration

 

[AdvancedAutoCC]

Just out of curiousity, I know the C4 is not the model which is matching numbers , collectors bla bla bla like the older models,

Just wait... NCRS is already judging 84-89 models, 90-96 can't be far behind...

why is everyone changing to the black interiour.

Black is a good neutral interior color (goes with everything), plus it just looks good!

I had the doubts myself but took the decission to take the original color again
( Graphite)

I took the sport seatcovers without perforations, hopefully it looks good.

took the interior screw kitt also ( thanks for the hint of making pics before)
can be a mess when you have a pile of parts to put back in the car

will start a fresh thread when the parts arrive to show my efford in C4 restoration

Excellent! keep us posted and good luck!

 

[WhalePirot]

Gee, I stayed with Carmine interior. It is part of the classic Corvette color combination!


Nice to know one's time and efforts are useful. Thanks for the gratis. I have to check if there are other pics.

With very little time driving the car, I am not sure how much difference the matting material makes; then, this ol' '84 really growls at idle and outright screams under firm go pedal pressure.

Quieting it is asking a bit much, but then, this hot rod brings tears of joy to a car guy's face. They stream back though furrows of grin at a hellish speed; then are dashed to mist at one's earlobes!

U listening, rrich?

 

[Chris Kennedy]

Frankly, the whole NCRS matching numbers/trailer queen "this is one of only 10,000 with the VNYTZ option" scene really turns me off. When somone decides to "organize" or "club" a hobby or passion is when all the office-style b.s. seems to start and fun goes out the window. It's also when things start getting expensive. Do the car up the way YOU want it, enjoy DRIVING it in the real world (even "my God" in the rain!), and just fix things when they break. You'll be far happier, and the car will run better and be far happier, too.

/s/ Chris Kennedy