stainless vs ceramic sidepipes for heat control

[baxsom]

I am debating with myself over sidepipes. I am either going to get a set of stainless for my 454 from the Superpowers guy that is selling the XS power brand (proven to fit perfectly) or a set of sterling ceramic coated from jet hot. I got an email from jet hot today saying that hooker has pulled their BBC pipes because of quality issue with welds and has no idea on when they will be coming back in. One of the reasons I am going to sidepipes is a cooler interior. Obviously the ceramic would be better for that reason but if Id like to hear from anyone who has stainless sidepipes about how much heat radiates through the floorboards compared to a normal exhaust.

 

[Crimson Thunder]

I'm about to order Stainless for my Vette. I don't know about the heat issue but i've seen ceramic sidepipes still rust at the welds over time.

 

[xplosive performance]

I will put my 2 cents in on this. With the classics like yours the 72 and 70 stainless is the only way to go. Here are my reasons. The jet Hot ceramic coating is an outside coating you still have a steel pipe. With these cars that most likely are not driven on a daily basis moisture stays on the inside of the pipes rusting away from the inside. Stainless is forever. If the pipe is made by a quality company the stainless weld most likely are tig welded vs mig and then tigged with at least a 306 or 308 rod when welding 304 stainless so the welds are higher alloy than the base metal and are stronger and more corrosion resistant.
Moving the exhaust out from underneath the car will help with heat on the inside of the car. Does the cermaic coating going to reduce heat anymore i really doubt that. The drawback with stainless if you want to look at it that way the stainless with turn a golden color over time that is the nickel in the alloy forming its protective coating. Now if the stainless turns blue, purple color thats telling you that you are running lean your egt's are high and you need to richen it up some. If you really plan on keeping the car then Stainless is well worth the added cost and is a good investment.

 

[sstearns2]

Get the stainless ones and have them ceramic coated. I just had the exhaust for my airplane made and it's 321 stainless and ceramic coated. There should be shops locally that can do ceramic coating. It's probably a couple hundred, maybe a bit less, to ceramic coat everything. Have them do the coating inside and out.

Cheers,
Scott

 

[baxsom]

I am definitely looking more and more to the stainless and then sending them to jet hot. Supposedly the XS power brand fits the big blocks beautifully. I have been doing as much research as I can and many people have came back and said that their jet hot coated ones have rusted over time. Im going to be living very near the beach in a few months so rust and corrosion control is a big deal.

 

[xplosive performance]

I will most likely get in trouble for this but oh well. Have you looked at the Stainless Works Inc. Side pipes?
Stainless Works
We have over the years installed many of their systems on both small and big block vettes. The fit is excellent and as a dealer we can work with you on pricing. They make both the factory replacement and the hooker four into one or i say that they did haven't had a call for those in years. They also make the headers in 304 for the side pipes
Stainless Works

Good luck with your car and if we can help let us know.

Thanks

 

[baxsom]

Actually never even heard of them. One of my concerns is performance. I didnt spend as much as I did dropping in a new crate motor to choke it with bad performing pipes so I would love to see some performance numbers on this set (as well as pictures) compared to a set of hooker pipes.

 

[xplosive performance]

I can get that info for you. I will contact them first thing monday and get what you need. Headers come with 2" primaries and flow into a 3" outlets. Are you looking for factory style side pipes or the hooker style that have the look of 4 header pipe into one sidepipe
Hooker styleFactory

Stainless Works Headers to be used with factory style side pipes



63-82 Corvette big block headers with 3" outlets. 2" 16 gauge primary tubes, CNC laser cut 3/8" thick flanges, to used with factory style side exhaust. Mill finish.


I will get all the other info for you monday as i don't have a picture of the Hooker style product they make.

Here is a video on their manufacturing plant. They make a lot of the private label product you see out there for people

YouTube - STAINLESSWORKSNET's Channel

 

[Crimson Thunder]

Actually never even heard of them. One of my concerns is performance. I didnt spend as much as I did dropping in a new crate motor to choke it with bad performing pipes so I would love to see some performance numbers on this set (as well as pictures) compared to a set of hooker pipes.

The mufflers you choose for the sidepipes will have the biggest effect on performance. Stay away from the reverse-flow mufflers that come in the Hookers. I'm going to go with the STS baffles,although they are the most expensive. There are many sound clips on Youtube of the different side pipe mufflers avaliable.

 

[baxsom]

I like the 4 into 1 design better. I read way too many posts in doing my research saying the factory style didnt flow that well. True or not, I dont know but I have also seen dyno numbers with the 4 into 1 showing how well it performed so I am going to go with what I can prove. As far as baffles, Im definitely going with STS. Too much research shows how well they perform to do anything else. The only negative thing I have heard about them is that they sound kinda "tinny" I personally dont care about sound myself. Performance is wayyy more important. Id leave the pipes open with no baffles if I could get away with it.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Now doubt, headers and sidepipes on Sharks are good looking and recall that "road racing" look of 40 years ago. They also, obviously, make a huge change in how the car sounds, both inside and outside. Lastly, performance with headers and sidepipes will improve over stock exhaust.

Downsides?:confused

There are several. First, virtually all header/sidepipe assemblies have primary pipe lengths that are usually too long for the best exhaust tuning. Secondly, it's very difficult to have an exhaust crossover and impossible to have an X-pipe, two additions that most modern, high-performance exhaust systems have. Lastly, unless you are going to drive with open exhaust (which, other than on a race track or if your already deaf, you won't do for long), there's usually a significant performance loss when you add the "slip-in" mufflers that go into the sidepipes.

A good set of under-chassis headers and a well designed and installed 2.5 or 3.0-in exhaust system will usually out-perform headers and side pipes. In fact, a good under-chassis header and exhaust system with proper low-restriction mufflers may outperfom open-exhaust sidepipes.

On the stainless steel vs. ceramic-metallic coated mild steel issue...obviously, the best way to go is stainless but it's freakin' expensive. For stainless headers and sidepipes, I betcha you'd be talking 2500 bucks just for the parts.

Weigh those pluses and minuses.

It was said earlier that there is doubt about ceramic metallic coatings thermally insulating exhaust systems. WTF? That's rediculous. Not only is there no doubt, but there is plenty of evidence that cerametallic coatings reduce heat radiation from exhaust systems. Because "Xplosive Performance" is in the Corvette parts and service business, a certain level of knowledge is assumed by customers. It seems to me, since exhaust systems are a big seller, part of that knowledge customers expect is an understanding of exhaust system coatings and their benefits. I suggest that if there's doubt, some basic research into coatings will remove that doubt or...test the idea yourself, using the resources you have available at your shop.

As for the corrosion issue, it is true that exhaust systems are more liable to corrode from inside out, but 1) there are some coaters who can coat the inside of exhaust systems and 2) most street high-performance, aftermarket systems which are aluminized mild steel tubing and then are coated are going to last a long, long time. The only exception would be systems on cars which are driven in cold winter weather in areas w on roads which are salted. If you drive your Vette in snow and ice and on salted roads, go with a stainless system.

 

[xplosive performance]

Dear Hib

If you would have read the question in the first place maybe you would understand my answer. The gentlemens comment was

One of the reasons I am going to sidepipes is a cooler interior. Obviously the ceramic would be better for that reason but if Id like to hear from anyone who has stainless sidepipes about how much heat radiates through the floorboards compared to a normal exhaust.

I am not saying that the ceramic coatings don't reduce temps yes your right there is all sort of data generated by the manufactures showing that. My point is ceramic coating your exhaust to keep your interior cooler i don't believe is going to make a hill of beans. Your interior is going to get hot at 500 degree exhaust temps vs 900 degree and you are not going to know the difference. Moving the exhaust out from under the car yes will help.
On a side pipe if your leg hits it your burnt at 500 vs 900. So we don't try to misled the customer we try to explain what is really happening. If you talk about ceramic coating in the engine bay and engine bay temps yes.

I really doubt you will see a difference in your interior temps on prolong driving of the car. that was my point. Use some good insulation and reflecta shields in the interior and under side of the car.

 

[Hib Halverson]

My position on this is that there's little doubt that coating an exhaust system reduces heat into the interior.

I've coated the entire exhaust systems and it feel it makes a difference. I agree, the difference is modest....like if your feet were sweating before they won't freeze afterwards, but you'll feel an improvement.

Racers and streeters have been coating headers for years because the coating reduces heat radiated to the underhood. It also keeps heat in the exhaust making the engine more efficient. There is little doubt that the same process works three feet farther down the exhaust system, ie: coating the pipes under the floor will reduce heat radiated from the exaust into the interior and it will keep that heat in the exhaust.

Note that you must coat the entire system, not just the headers, to see a benefit because it's the coating on the pipes that run under the floor and the seats that makes the difference.

Now...as for the burning the leg part...I still have scars from the C2 road racer I used to tune for a friend, so I totally agree that coating the sidepipes will not prevent that problem. If the OP's question was about the smell of burning flesh and not sweaty feet, I missed it and apologize.

 

[xplosive performance]

No need to apologize. I work everyday with our guys to try to teach them to listen to the customer. So many people out there read a little something and think that there is going to be a world of difference and thats not always the case. Just look at the ads manufactures run oh put this on and gain 25hp come on you and i know that heck if you believe that you could build a 1000hp motor cheap and we know thats not the case. I agree with everything you say and we tell customers that. Don't be looking for that magic bullet. On a race car no doubt everything you said we agree with. On a street car ???? After coating a complete exhaust system in ceramic vs stainless and some heat shield insulation what is really the cost difference and we know no matter where you live stainless is forever.
Thanks and have a good day and weekend