standard versus double roller timing chain difference?

[80convertible]

What is the difference between a standard timing chain and a double roller, and do I really need a double roller? I hope to replace the cam in the near future to tap into the flow of my vortec heads. I expect 300 rwhp after the cam swap. I don't drag or race...just sunday driving, so I don't like to waste money on things I don't need. Advice appreciated.

 

[Robin7TFour]

Mr 80, a double roller is just what it sounds like. two rows of chain instead of the single row. yes, it would be stronger,but IMHO,the double is totally unnecessary for street use,even hard running.
for your cam upgrade a single row chain with steel gears top and bottom,you'll be fine with no worries.
years back i built up a 327 to 350h/p specs. i ran that 68 camaro REAL hard and never worried about the chain

good luck

ROBIN

 

[wishuwerehere82]

Cloyes makes a nice double roller chain and gear set that doesn't cost that much more than a standard chain. It will be stronger than a single chain and will last much longer without stretching. That's why I put one in my '82, even though it's stock.

 

[wallyknoch]

A double is nice for a performance engine, the GM trucks offer them as OEM. However there are two double rollers, one the "true roller" by Cloyes which is very expensive as opposed to the a regular double tooth set up. Confusing? A little but neither is actually necessary. All the high HP Chevy engines use a single set up as there OEM choice, including L88`s and LS7`s.

 

[Ken]

The things one finds when looking for something else entirely ... :eyerole

I was going to add my two cents worth here, and tell you what I was running in my build, which I have listed on my web site as a Dynagear True Roller; but when I went to check the site for an image to show you, the old Dynagear site (http://www.dynagear.com/) doesn't exist, or rather, the domain name is up for sale. So, upon further research, I find that Cloyes Gear & Products, Inc. now owns Dynagear.

December 19, 2002

PRESS RELEASE

Cloyes Gear and Products, Inc. Announces the Acquisition of Dynagear® Inc.'s Timing Component Business

See more information here.

Always learnin' something new.

 

[wallyknoch]

Ken

I think if I car recall, Dynagear was the actual manufacture of the Cloyes and others who were merely repackagers, including TRW and Federal Mogul. I too use to sell Dynagear parts. In fact I just sold a Cloyes Big block set today. oop`s , yesterday.

Wally Knoch

 

[Ken]

From Cloyes:

Cloyes Gear and Products, Inc. Announces the Acquisition of Dynagear® Inc.'s Timing Component Business

Paris, Arkansas, USA, December 19, 2002: Cloyes Gear & Products Inc. announces that it has acquired the assets of Dynagear Inc.’s timing component business.

Headquartered in Paris, AR, Cloyes Gear is an OEM and aftermarket manufacturer of automotive engine timing components and related products. Dynagear Timing is based in Downers Grove, IL and is an aftermarket manufacturer of automotive timing components. Dynagear Timing filed for bankruptcy protection in April of 2002.

Cloyes Gear & Products, Inc. is an 80-year-old company with manufacturing facilities in Arkansas, Oklahoma and Germany. Focused on one product line, Cloyes is the industry leader in supplying the aftermarket with timing components for passenger cars, light and heavy-duty trucks, industrial and agricultural applications. Cloyes is also world renown for their High Performance timing products, which have been used by racers for decades.

Cloyes customers are serviced out of their Fort Smith, AR Distribution Center, which consistently fills orders in the 95-97% range and has an average turnaround time of one day on 90% of all orders received. Additionally, Cloyes customers have access to the largest offering of timing components in the aftermarket, particularly later model applications.

Cloyes personnel will be contacting Dynagear Timing customers to review transition issues and procedures. For more information, contact Cloyes customer service at (479) 963-2105.

 

[Vette/Berlina-coupe]

-why would you not want to upgrade...

-to reinstall an old-fashioned Link&Rivit type Timing-chain seems silly (unless it is an old-clunker Chevy you are just patching-up to sell); -the Double-roller significantly reduces running-friction, is longer-lasting and thus maintains your Eng.-timing more precisely. All bicycles & motorcycles use Roller-chain (don't believe Harley still sells the Cog-belt, and rubber-band timing-belts don't have the durability), --why just imagine how much pedaling-effort would increase on a bicycle fitted with a primative Link&Rivit type of chain!! Employing a generic-brand Roller/Timing-chain (or "TrueRoller-chain" as Cloyes calls them, -samething, but Cloyes is just a more expensive brand-name) is just one of the unseen tricks performance-experts pull when they are trying for peak-power or fuel-economy. As a point of reference vrs. your local/autoparts-store, --a quality replacement Dual-roller/Timing-chain&cogs -set only runs about $32(+ $9-ship.) from www.SummitRacing.com
~Bob vH :crazy :dance

 

[wallyknoch]

TRUE ROLLER VRS Double roller.

Yep, the double roller costs only 30 bucks, but the true roller is more like $80.00. Big difference

 

[Red69]

Thanks for all the info on the roller chain, but how does a gear drive compare? I know they replace the timing chain with gears and obviously eliminates chain stretch, but can the price be justified with performance? I do not have first hand experience with them, as I was a poor boy for performance. My JEGS catalog has them for around $150.

 

[JohnZ]

The only thing gear drives are good for on a street car is the "gee-whiz" factor from the howling noise (so the teenyboppers think you have a blower); the "fun factor" from having one on your car lasts about three days, then it'll drive you crazy.

 

[Red69]

Thanks John, that explains the catalog description of "machined for more noise" and priced at $94. I'm way too old for that game.

 

[80convertible]

Well I guess for the small increase in price it is worth it to get the double roller. Thanks for the input.

 

[Vettehead Mikey]

The only thing gear drives are good for on a street car is the "gee-whiz" factor from the howling noise (so the teenyboppers think you have a blower); the "fun factor" from having one on your car lasts about three days, then it'll drive you crazy.

First time I've been called a teenybopper in years. I was sure that Thunder's '68 had a blower first time I heard it.

 

[wallyknoch]

Gear Drives

Yes I use them, the gear drives that is. But only in my race cars. John has it right, you dont need one. I have no problem with a true roller setup, it`s about as good as you can get. Will handle nearly anything you can put against it, except supercharged Gas or Nitro.

 

[Jack]

I think this is kinda interesting. For sbc ... The rollers on the Cloyes "Hex-A-Just" and "ORIGINAL True" roller with "Renold" chain are NOT seamless. Renold-chained "True" rollers are rolled from flat stock and have a seam and then ground "true" and hardened. For sbc this includes Cloyes Hex-A-Just set P/Ns 9-3100A & 9-3145A & Original set P/Ns 9-3100 & 9-3145... those sets using chain P/N 9-130.

Cloyes "Street" True roller sets do have "seamless" rollers but do not have "Renold" chains. Those sets' rollers are "extruded". For sbc these include Cloyes set P/N 9-1100 & 9-1145 ... those sets using chain P/N 9-145.

All of the above P/Ns have double-roller chains with 0.250" OD rollers. Seems counterintuitive that the high-dollar Renold-chained sets' rollers would have seams, but I confirmed after I was sorting through several used chains and sets ... things didn't "seem" to add up ... so I talked with Cloyes tech (Wayne Gray) ... he confirmed the above. Apparently, extruded seamless rollers are not quite as round (concentric) as Renold's "ground" rollers. However ... when you step below the Street true rollers and get into their heavy duty double-roller sets ... such as C-3023 & C-3023X ... using chain C163 ... their split rollers (with seam) are not ground and not hardened and have slightly smaller OD ... this is a set that sells for about $14-$20 ... and is just fine for a peppy street car.

So, the upshot is this: Not all split roller chains are equal ... some are better than a seamless roller ... some are not.

We run Hex-A-Just 9-3100A in our circle track car ... "usually" with split roller true Renold chain 9-130 ... in future will always be 9-130 chain ... until Cloyes comes online with a better one.

I also learned that Cloyes is prototyping with another "true-ground" split roller chain supplier ... theirs have the rollers' ID reamed true also. May supplant Renold as Cloyes premier chain.

For folks with LS-1 ... due to clearance constraints, they must run a single-row chain ... Cloyes has Hex-A-Just competition sets with single-row "true" Renold roller chains ... set P/Ns 9-3153A and extreme duty 9-3153AL.
JACK:gap

edit: Motorville 1-888-463-0482 has asian-origin gear drives for sbc as low as $69.95.