grumpyvette
Well-known member
synthetic oils break down much slower than mineral oil base automotive oils but they still pick up crud from the combustion process like other oils do so if your useing a top quality synthetic filter you can extend the time between oil changes slightly with no bad effects but I still change even syntectic oil about every 4000 miles MAX, OIL CHANGES ARE DAMN CHEAP ENGINE INSURANCE even at $4 a qt! good mineral oil costs about $1.45 a qt a good filter is about $5 so a normal mineral base oil change on a 7 qt engine cost close to $15 every 3000 miles or $500 on oil changes per 100,000 miles with mineral oil.A good synthetic can be bought for $4.14 a qt so useing the same filter an oil change every 4000 miles runs about $34 so your spending about $850 per 100,000 miles useing syntectic or about 3.5 cents a mile more for synthetic oil but its not at all unusual for an engine run on mineral oil to need an overhaul at 150,000 miles that cost a hell of a lot more than the $350 extra you would spent on syntectic oil and most engines run on strait synthectic are still in great shape a 200,000 miles of normal daily driveing if you change that SYNTHECTIC oil EVERY 4000 MILES!
a sign in a garage I used to work at said this
YOU CAN USE GOOD OIL AND PAY A LITTLE MORE NOW OR USE CHEAP OIL AND PAY ALOT MORE LATER....YOUR CHOICE!!!
THAT WAS IN THE 60S AND THINGS HAVE NOT CHANGED MUCH IN THAT REGUARD!
READ THIS
http://www.mr2.com/TEXT/synth_oil.txt
http://www.theautochannel.com/e_about/
take the time to read the links guys its WELL WORTH THE 2 HOURS IT MAY TAKE READING
http://www.wondermagnet.com/dev/magnet42.html
http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html
http://www.dorianyeager.com/oilfilterstudy1.html
http://www.fernblatt.com/longhurst/engineoil_bible.html
http://www.melling.com/highvol.html
http://www.melling.com/engoil.html
http://www.melling.com/miscon.html
read this,
http://www.babcox.com/editorial/us/uhs89734.htm
http://www.babcox.com/editorial/cm/cm99828.htm
http://www.ahooga.com/archive/messages2/6273.shtml
http://www.dragnbreath.com/Clevite/TN 22.html
http://www.dragnbreath.com/Clevite/TN 16.html
http://www.aera.org/Tech/tb1465r.htm
here read thisHigh Volume Pumps, Advantages, Myths & Fables
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most of the stock automobile engines are designed to operate from idle to 4500 RPM. The original volume and pressure oil pump will work fine in this type of application. As the demands on the engine increase so does the demands on the oiling system and pump.
The oil pump's most difficult task is to supply oil to the connecting rod bearing that is the farthest from the pump. To reach this bearing, the oil travels from three to four feet, turns numerous square corners thru small holes in the crankshaft to the rod bearing. The rod bearing doesn't help matters. It is traveling in a circle which means centrifugal force is pulling the oil out of the bearing.
A 350 Chevy has a 3.4811 stroke and a 2.111 rod journal. The outer edge of the journal travels 17.5311 every revolution. At 1000 RPM, the outer edge is traveling at 16.6 MPH and 74.7 MPH at 4500 RPM. If we take this engine to 6500 the outer edge is up to 107.9 and at 8500 it is 141.1 MPH. Now imagine driving a car around a curve at those speeds and you can feel the centrifugal force. Now imagine doing it around a circle with a 5.581, diameter.
The size of the gears or rotors determines the amount of oil a pump can move at any given RPM. Resistance to this movement creates the pressure. If a pump is not large enough to meet the demands of the engine, there will not be any pressure. Or if the demands of the engine are increased beyond the pumps capabilities there will be a loss of oil pressure. This is where high volume pumps come in; they take care of any increased demands of the engine.
Increases in the engine's oil requirements come from higher RPM, being able to rev faster, increased bearing clearances, remote oil cooler and/or filter and any combination of these. Most high volume pumps also have a increase in pressure to help get the oil out to the bearings faster.
That is what a high volume pump will do. Now let Is consider what it will not do.
It will not replace a rebuild in a worn-out engine. It may increase pressure but the engine is still worn-out.
It will not pump the oil pan dry. Both solid and hydraulic lifters have metering valves to limit flow of the oil to the top of the engine. If a pan is pumped dry, it is because the holes that drain oil back to the pan are plugged. If the high volume pump is also higher pressure, there will be a slight increase in flow to the top.
It will not wear out distributor gears. The load on the gear is directly related to the resistance to flow. Oil pressure is the measure of resistance to flow. The Ford 427 FE "side oiler" used a pump with relief valve set at 125 psi and it used a standard distributor gear. Distributor gear failures are usually caused by a worn gear on a new cam gear and/or worn bearings allowing misalignment.
It will not cause foaming of the oil. With any oil pump, the excess oil not needed by the engine is recirculated within the pump. Any additional foaming is usually created by revving the engine higher. The oil thrown from the rod bearings is going faster and causes the foaming. This is why high performance engines use a windage tray.
It will not cause spark scatter. Because of the pump pressure there is a load on the distributor gear. The number of teeth on the oil pump gears determine the number of impulses per revolution of the pump. In a SB Chevy there are seven teeth on each gear giving 14 impulses per revolution. At 6000 RPM the oil pump is turning 3000 RPM or 50 revolutions per second. To have an effect on the distributor, these impulses would have to vibrate the distributor gear through an intermediate shaft that has loose connections at both ends. Spark scatter is usually caused by weak springs in the points or dust inside the distributor cap.
High volume pumps can be a big advantage if used where needed. If installed in an engine that does not need the additional volume, they will not create a problem. The additional flow will be recirculated within the pump.
ALSO READ THIS
http://www.melling.com/engoil.html
thank you 85chevypu I had miss- placed that site in my notes
the MILODON PEOPLE HAVE THIS TO SAY
Milodon Hi-Volume/Hi-Pressure Oil Pumps provide a 20% to 30% increase in performance both in volume and pressure. And most heavy duty and performance applications require an increase in both areas. Increased bearing loads, increased RPM and horsepower all place greater demand on the oil system which, if not up to the job, can cause very premature engine failure. All Milodon oil pumps are 100% flow tested to assure you the quality your engine demands.
and MOROSO
http://www.moroso.com/catalog/categorydisplay.asp?catcode=14444
the high pressure spring only raises the oil pressure about 10psi and its generally accepted that you need 10 psi per 1000rpm minimum oil pressure but almost everyone meassures that oil pressure near the pressure source in the rear of the block but for the measurement to be valid it must be taken at the front of the block where the oil pressure is substantially less due to the oil flowing past 98 other leakage points(read this)the voluum will be equal to the pumps sweep voluum times the rpm of the pump, since the high voluum pump has a sweep voluum 1.3-1.5 times the standard pump voluum it will push 1.3-1.5 times the voluum of oil up to the bypass cicuit cut in point, that means that since the engine bearings leakage rate increases faster as the rpms increase because the clearances don,t change but the bleed off rate does that the amount of oil and the pressure that it is under will increase faster and reach the bypass circuit pressure faster with the high voluum pump. the advantage here is that the metal parts MUST be floated on that oil film to keep the metal parts from touching/wearing and the more leakage points the oil flows by the less the voluum of oil thats available for each leakage point beyond it and as the oil heats up it becomes easier to push through the clearences.now as the rpms and cylinder preasures increase in your goal to add power the loads trying to squeeze that oil out of those clearances also increase. ALL mods that increase power either increase rpms,cylinder preasures or reduce friction or mechanical losses. there are many oil leakage points(100) in a standard chevy engine.
16 lifter to push rod points
16 pushrod to rocker arm points
32 lifter bores 16 x 2 ends
10 main bearing edges
9 cam bearing edges
16 rod bearing edges
2 distributor shaft leaks
1 distributor shaft to shim above the cam gear(some engines that have an oil pressure feed distributor shaft bearing.)
so the more oil voluum the better.
by the time it gets there.
a sign in a garage I used to work at said this
YOU CAN USE GOOD OIL AND PAY A LITTLE MORE NOW OR USE CHEAP OIL AND PAY ALOT MORE LATER....YOUR CHOICE!!!
THAT WAS IN THE 60S AND THINGS HAVE NOT CHANGED MUCH IN THAT REGUARD!
READ THIS
http://www.mr2.com/TEXT/synth_oil.txt
http://www.theautochannel.com/e_about/
take the time to read the links guys its WELL WORTH THE 2 HOURS IT MAY TAKE READING
http://www.wondermagnet.com/dev/magnet42.html
http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html
http://www.dorianyeager.com/oilfilterstudy1.html
http://www.fernblatt.com/longhurst/engineoil_bible.html
http://www.melling.com/highvol.html
http://www.melling.com/engoil.html
http://www.melling.com/miscon.html
read this,
http://www.babcox.com/editorial/us/uhs89734.htm
http://www.babcox.com/editorial/cm/cm99828.htm
http://www.ahooga.com/archive/messages2/6273.shtml
http://www.dragnbreath.com/Clevite/TN 22.html
http://www.dragnbreath.com/Clevite/TN 16.html
http://www.aera.org/Tech/tb1465r.htm
here read thisHigh Volume Pumps, Advantages, Myths & Fables
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Most of the stock automobile engines are designed to operate from idle to 4500 RPM. The original volume and pressure oil pump will work fine in this type of application. As the demands on the engine increase so does the demands on the oiling system and pump.
The oil pump's most difficult task is to supply oil to the connecting rod bearing that is the farthest from the pump. To reach this bearing, the oil travels from three to four feet, turns numerous square corners thru small holes in the crankshaft to the rod bearing. The rod bearing doesn't help matters. It is traveling in a circle which means centrifugal force is pulling the oil out of the bearing.
A 350 Chevy has a 3.4811 stroke and a 2.111 rod journal. The outer edge of the journal travels 17.5311 every revolution. At 1000 RPM, the outer edge is traveling at 16.6 MPH and 74.7 MPH at 4500 RPM. If we take this engine to 6500 the outer edge is up to 107.9 and at 8500 it is 141.1 MPH. Now imagine driving a car around a curve at those speeds and you can feel the centrifugal force. Now imagine doing it around a circle with a 5.581, diameter.
The size of the gears or rotors determines the amount of oil a pump can move at any given RPM. Resistance to this movement creates the pressure. If a pump is not large enough to meet the demands of the engine, there will not be any pressure. Or if the demands of the engine are increased beyond the pumps capabilities there will be a loss of oil pressure. This is where high volume pumps come in; they take care of any increased demands of the engine.
Increases in the engine's oil requirements come from higher RPM, being able to rev faster, increased bearing clearances, remote oil cooler and/or filter and any combination of these. Most high volume pumps also have a increase in pressure to help get the oil out to the bearings faster.
That is what a high volume pump will do. Now let Is consider what it will not do.
It will not replace a rebuild in a worn-out engine. It may increase pressure but the engine is still worn-out.
It will not pump the oil pan dry. Both solid and hydraulic lifters have metering valves to limit flow of the oil to the top of the engine. If a pan is pumped dry, it is because the holes that drain oil back to the pan are plugged. If the high volume pump is also higher pressure, there will be a slight increase in flow to the top.
It will not wear out distributor gears. The load on the gear is directly related to the resistance to flow. Oil pressure is the measure of resistance to flow. The Ford 427 FE "side oiler" used a pump with relief valve set at 125 psi and it used a standard distributor gear. Distributor gear failures are usually caused by a worn gear on a new cam gear and/or worn bearings allowing misalignment.
It will not cause foaming of the oil. With any oil pump, the excess oil not needed by the engine is recirculated within the pump. Any additional foaming is usually created by revving the engine higher. The oil thrown from the rod bearings is going faster and causes the foaming. This is why high performance engines use a windage tray.
It will not cause spark scatter. Because of the pump pressure there is a load on the distributor gear. The number of teeth on the oil pump gears determine the number of impulses per revolution of the pump. In a SB Chevy there are seven teeth on each gear giving 14 impulses per revolution. At 6000 RPM the oil pump is turning 3000 RPM or 50 revolutions per second. To have an effect on the distributor, these impulses would have to vibrate the distributor gear through an intermediate shaft that has loose connections at both ends. Spark scatter is usually caused by weak springs in the points or dust inside the distributor cap.
High volume pumps can be a big advantage if used where needed. If installed in an engine that does not need the additional volume, they will not create a problem. The additional flow will be recirculated within the pump.
ALSO READ THIS
http://www.melling.com/engoil.html
thank you 85chevypu I had miss- placed that site in my notes
the MILODON PEOPLE HAVE THIS TO SAY
Milodon Hi-Volume/Hi-Pressure Oil Pumps provide a 20% to 30% increase in performance both in volume and pressure. And most heavy duty and performance applications require an increase in both areas. Increased bearing loads, increased RPM and horsepower all place greater demand on the oil system which, if not up to the job, can cause very premature engine failure. All Milodon oil pumps are 100% flow tested to assure you the quality your engine demands.
and MOROSO
http://www.moroso.com/catalog/categorydisplay.asp?catcode=14444
the high pressure spring only raises the oil pressure about 10psi and its generally accepted that you need 10 psi per 1000rpm minimum oil pressure but almost everyone meassures that oil pressure near the pressure source in the rear of the block but for the measurement to be valid it must be taken at the front of the block where the oil pressure is substantially less due to the oil flowing past 98 other leakage points(read this)the voluum will be equal to the pumps sweep voluum times the rpm of the pump, since the high voluum pump has a sweep voluum 1.3-1.5 times the standard pump voluum it will push 1.3-1.5 times the voluum of oil up to the bypass cicuit cut in point, that means that since the engine bearings leakage rate increases faster as the rpms increase because the clearances don,t change but the bleed off rate does that the amount of oil and the pressure that it is under will increase faster and reach the bypass circuit pressure faster with the high voluum pump. the advantage here is that the metal parts MUST be floated on that oil film to keep the metal parts from touching/wearing and the more leakage points the oil flows by the less the voluum of oil thats available for each leakage point beyond it and as the oil heats up it becomes easier to push through the clearences.now as the rpms and cylinder preasures increase in your goal to add power the loads trying to squeeze that oil out of those clearances also increase. ALL mods that increase power either increase rpms,cylinder preasures or reduce friction or mechanical losses. there are many oil leakage points(100) in a standard chevy engine.
16 lifter to push rod points
16 pushrod to rocker arm points
32 lifter bores 16 x 2 ends
10 main bearing edges
9 cam bearing edges
16 rod bearing edges
2 distributor shaft leaks
1 distributor shaft to shim above the cam gear(some engines that have an oil pressure feed distributor shaft bearing.)
so the more oil voluum the better.
by the time it gets there.
