the latest Fad

[BarryK]

Then, he was right.

I agree.
We don't have to like anybody elses cars - only the owner has to like his own car.

 

[richscorvettes]

Larry,



I thought Barry’s comments were right on the mark. Having been on both sides of the question, and having enjoyed each for what they bring to the hobby, I can honestly say we are having more fun now than ever. For us that's what keeps us interested.



I guess it all boils down to what appeals to you most and what gives you the most satisfaction from the hobby. If it’s the investment aspect then the original restorations are likely to bring the most consistent dollar return and appeal to a broader segment of buyers. That presumes that the car would have been reasonable to restore to the same condition as it left the factory and that was what appealed to you. However, if you get a kick out of building something unique to express your own vision of what a Vette should be, then your current project will give you many returns in the form of satisfaction from designing and building something yourself. As Barry points out, if modifying a car is a fad it’s sure a long-lived one and would seem to counter that label.



While we would never start with a real “original” car for a project like these, there are many cars out there that are good candidates for modifying. The thing that keeps our interest fresh in the hobby is the variety of ways there are for each of us to enjoy it in our own way.



For us it’s always interesting to see the variety of custom cars out there and, even if it’s not something we might want to do ourselves, there’s usually enough from a design or workmanship perspective to appreciate what it took to build it. While these cars might not be for everyone, the hobby would be a lot less interesting without them.



I know we’re all looking forward to seeing your project completed but have enjoyed seeing it progress through its various stages just as much. Best of luck with the rest of the project.

Rich Lagasse

 

[Red64]

If you don't change your car today, those guys in the future won't have anything to do but fight with their wives. Your doing them a favor! :L

 

[67HEAVEN]

If you don't change your car today, those guys in the future won't have anything to do but fight with their wives. Your doing them a favor! :L

Actually, Red, the only reason we posted in this thread was to get you to say, "Howdy".



Welcome to

 

[paul67]

Barry,
There's a lounge chair. But I can't see the TV.

 

[John Mcgraw]

I agree with Rich. It is not like we are butchering good restorable cars to begin with! Anyone that would have considered restoring my 59 would require a check-up from the neck-up. We all love restored cars, My last car was a Top Flight and Duntov award winner, and my next car may be a judged car as well. The 59 and the 65 that I am working on, both were truly cars that were parts cars. I would agree to some extent that some modified cars will be viewed in the future as "fad" cars, but true quality work will always be quality work. My guess is that a car like one of ours will allways be appreciated since we are keeping the essence of the original car and only improving those items that made the original car a pain to drive. Cars like the Pro-street fad, will fade from favor since they are just plain miserable to drive on the street. Cars like this are more for appearance than driving and will wear out their welcome very fast. My 59 will be just as much fun to drive 20 years from now as it is today, and who knows, I may pull the LS1 out in ten years and replace it with the latest drive train available again!

Regards, John McGraw

 

[BarryK]

Paul

I have a feeling the TV is there because that looks suspeciously like a VHS deck under the passenger side dash.

 

[IH2LOSE]

If you don't change your car today, those guys in the future won't have anything to do but fight with their wives. Your doing them a favor! :L

Welcome abourd red64

 

[Duntov-097]

I agree with almost everything said above. My one exception is not starting with a resto candidate. I mean if you've seen one NCRS restored 61 you've seen them all. Cookie cutter cars built to the standards of a judging manual. I appreciate the restored cars and enjoy seeing them but if every one was restored it would be mighty boring. I can see not modding a "survivor" or an especially rare car ie: L-88, Big Brake fuelie, etc. but I would recommend starting off with as complete a car as you can afford.


This is what I started with. A barn fresh 57' 283/245 with every number matching except the trans. Original carbs even had the foil tags on them still, Correct 997 heads, generator, water pump, dist. 3.70 posi rear etc. All in all a pretty correct little car. I initially felt bad and tried selling it, but the reality was there was no way I could replace it for what people were willing to pay. I was asking 35k and people were offering 25k. I paid 20k. Just for reference the "Concept 57' body from Corvette central was 12k at the time and a rolling chassis from SRIII $10,500. At this point I would have no chrome, interior, glass, guages, etc. It would have cost a fortune to build one this way. It would have cost me even more to restore it. So all my parts went to other guys to restore their cars the way they wanted and I got their money to finish mine the way I wanted.

My father and I had a great time building it and thats what really matters. I have a original 57' that I love just as much, but the conversion car is just a different kind of fun. The guy that pries my cold dead hands from the steering wheel when I die can worry about restoring it. I still have the original short block, an extra trunk pan and NOS inner fenders for him too.

 

[IH2LOSE]

Here is a picture of duntovs car august of 03 or 02 at carlilse

I thinks it looks spectacular!

EDIT

I floped the photo to make it match the one he posted.

Quite some difference from when he got it

 

[Duntov-097]

Thanks Can't wait to see yours !

 

[vette rod]

WOW :eek

 

[henny496]

Pro Street Cars

Hello John
I read your post on the pro street car fad and I wanted to clarify something.

A lot of the handling problems with a Pro Street car is due to the rear suspension set up. A 4 link rear suspension is basically an adjustable ladder bar with a variable instant center. The instant center is the point at which the two bars theoretically point to, which is necessary for the proper weight distribution.
The problem arises from that : If you imagine a circle and think of the upper left quadrant, and then draw a line out at 45 degrees in that quadrant.
The bottom line would be your lower bar (paralell) The 45 degree line would imitate the upper bar. If you move the suspension up 2 inches(bars) the top bar will actually shorten much more than the lower bar. This would make the top of your rear end housing pull in with upward suspension movement.
On a racetrack this is not a problem, because the bumps are almost nil, and that they are hopefully even for the width of the track.
What happens on a street car is that the bumps/dips can be on one side of your car. When that happens the one side pulls the top of the rear end in while the other side doing the opposite, which pushes the rear end out.
When you hit a bump/dip(one side) the rear end of the car is pointing in a different direction than you are, with 3 ft of rubber to push with. Some pro street cars use a very narrow tire, which does not help combat the situation.
All you do then is to mount your top bar paralell to the bottom one for street use, and then drop it down to the required position for racing. Paralell arms are used in street rods for that reason. The car won't hook as good as the race set up, but it makes driving much easier.
Spools don't help the matter, but you can change pots or center sections if you require.
If there are race cars with lots of rubber out back, I think there will always be some street cars the same way
take care
Tom
If the car looks fast, it should be fast

 

[John Mcgraw]

Tom,

I am not knocking the pro-street look. If that is what floats someones boat, then what business is it of mine? The large tires are part of the dirveability issue in themselves as is the traditional suspension setup. To drive one of these monster tire cars on even slightly damp pavement, can make you need to change your shorts in short order. The entire look of the car is designed to emulate a pro drag car, and you have to sacrifice ride quality and handling to achieve the look. For me, this is not a car I would enjoy driving on a daily basis, but hey, different strokes for different folks!

Regards, John McGraw

 

[wallyknoch]

Heres the alternative to restoring and that is basically leave them alone and keep them close to original from day one. No chopping on this piece.

 

[67HEAVEN]

No chopping on this piece.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Wally. Like it came from the factory with a trailer hitch.

 

[Duntov-097]

Heres the alternative to restoring and that is basically leave them alone and keep them close to original from day one. No chopping on this piece.

You're lucky to have a car like that. It must be nice to have owned it since day one She's a beauty !

 

[IH2LOSE]

Heres the alternative to restoring and that is basically leave them alone and keep them close to original from day one. No chopping on this piece.

Hey Wally these 2 guys reminded me of the day I met you.They have been playing with cars forever and the one fellow still has his high school lead slead. I cant wait to get a tour of there place.My day with you was a memory for life THANKS AGAIN!

 

[ctjackster]

here's the thing - when I got my Chevy Avalanche in Nov 0f 2001, I got together with a group of Avalanche owners in a net forum, and we all, or almost all, set about modding the car we all loved - not because we disliked it but because we wanted to personalize and improve it - tried swapping in the power folding mirrors found on the Caddy EXT, for instance, or imported the steering wheel radio controls from the GMC Denali (none such offered on 2002 Avalanches) and certainly added some or all of the upgrade package features to those Avalanches that were more of a base version - I put the "Z71" 17 rims on my bases 4x4 Avalanche. This would be like owning a SB in 65 and seeing that Big Block hood appear on the late 65s, and just having to put that bad boy on your SB car (which many did, my 65 included). Some of us did put more agressive hoods on our Avalanches, in fact. Those who modded their trucks seemed to be the ones who had the most passion for the vehicle, the guys who just bought one, sold it a or two later untouched, perhaps got newer model - they were not nearly as passionate about Avalanche ownership

I am sure that the guy who bought my 65 Vette new, if he wasn't some older guy :eyerole , immediately set about improving and personalizing his ride. If you are doing the same thing today on a C2, or happen to own a C2 that has flares, etc. - you are just carrying on the tradition. Sure, there are difrferent price points for the two basic categories - original engine, orignal color, original body cars, and the others - but see how the resto mods did at the last two BJ auctions? That gap is closing.

and plus, who the F*%# cares what others think - this is MY car, it gives ME wood when I look at it and drive it, that's all I need. Now go one home in your minivan before I scare you by blipping the go pedal and talking out of my sidepipes! Now git!

 

[wallyknoch]

My Keeper

Heres the alternative to restoring and that is basically leave them alone and keep them close to original from day one. No chopping on this piece.

Hey Wally these 2 guys reminded me of the day I met you.They have been playing with cars forever and the one fellow still has his high school lead slead. I cant wait to get a tour of there place.My day with you was a memory for life THANKS AGAIN!

Thanks, Larry
By the way, The Black 76 went for 31 and is in NY

67HEAVEN, Do you mean this, Why not a hitch, it pulls my drag boats with ease, and besides why leave the Vette home. I bought it to drive and it use to be my daily. But the Dayton knock-off wires were or have been on it since it was 9 miles old.

Thanks Duntov