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Turbo

ptorlax18

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
32
Location
Deer Park, Long Island
Corvette
1986 Silver and Black Coupe
I am very interested in the turbo that was highlighted in teh new VETTE magazine. I am really thinking of getting this for 86. If you guys get a chance to see this article let me know what you think. It says it puts out abot 8 pounds and making between 250 and 300 hp. Do you think it would be a good up grade or do u guys think it would end up creating more problems in the log run i have almost all stock parts wih athe exception of exhaust and brakes and a few other do dads no big stuff. Let me know so i stop second guessing myself. The turbo is made by HP Turbos and teh website is hpturbos.com. they dont have the c4 turbo listed but they do have teh c5 up and it relly isnt alot so i happy about that. so let me know thanks!
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
Well since I have been building and driving blower engines since 1976 I can probably give you a little insite on this subject.
First off you will not get 300hp from 8lbs. boost especially not with stock heads and cam. I don't recall what the 86 had but about 240 so with 8lbs if you are Lucky you could see a 125hp increase.
I would never try to deter you from doing this because their is nothing like driving an engine with forced induction. Boost is addicting but unless you are very mechanically inclined or have a good local mechanic and are willing to spend a ton of money on this project then this is not what you should do.
All the kits that I know of need changes made to them the one you are referring to is brand new untried design and just from looking at the pictures on their site I see some things that I don't think look all that well engineered.
After you have the kit installed you are just getting started you will need to upgrade nearly everything to make it perform right.
Here is a list of my current car. This list is about two years old I need to update it because I have done several mods since this list was made but you can see what happens when you start down that road. I could buy a new Z06 and have money left over for what I have spent on my 89. Do I regret it NO if I had a new car it would be just like thousands of others on the road I would rather have what I have besides that the look on their face when I blow their doors off with my old C4 is priceless
I don't think their are many on this forum running FI but if you go to Corvette Forum and go to the C4 Forced Induction section you will find several who have made homebuilt turbo systems and guy's with superchargers.
What I'm trying to convey to you is be prepared to spend far more than the price of the kit. If you don't believe me just go their and ask them like me who has done it what is the cost. If you are willing to see it through and commit to spending that much on an old car then go for it.

89Black coupe 6spd FX-3 \ Chrome GS Wheels 315\35\17 G-ForceKD's \ SB-406cid\ Procharger D1-R \ 8 Rib pulleys\ Custom built Spearco intercooler \ Spal Fans \ NOS wet nitrous system controlled by jacobs mastermind controller \ Spearco water/alcohol injection system \ TPIS Mini Ram II \ 58mmTB \ AFR heads \ AFR rev kit \ Manley4340 push rods \
Comp cams custom grind roller \ Comp cam lifters \ Comp cams roller rockers 1.6 ratio \ Ross custom pistons 4340 pins \Speed pro rings \ 6 inch eagle 4340 3d rods \ eagle 4340 crank \ fluid balancer \ Cloyes true roller timing chain \ Melling high output oil pump \ 10 qt. multi trap door pan \ large oil cooler \ MSD-Digital-7 ignition\With MSD pro-power coil \ MSD boost retard \ Msd super conductor wires \ Accel DFI Gen.7 W/wide band \ 83lbs injectors \ Centerforce clutch & flywheel \ TPIS jet hot coated headers \ 13 inch rotors C5 calipers w hawk pads \ Air dam with air ducts to brakes \ Triple pillar pod with Autometer gauges \ Air-Fuel \Boost \Fuel Pressure \ lowering kit \Escort radar detector \RM radar jammer.
The difference between men and boy’s is the speed of their toy’s.
IF IT’S NOT BLOWN THEN IT SUCKS
 

ptorlax18

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
32
Location
Deer Park, Long Island
Corvette
1986 Silver and Black Coupe
Thank alot! that is the advice i needed. The fact that i am 19 and i am still in college i am going to hold off on this project. Is there any other up grades i can do to give my car a kick i just want a little more power. Thanks alot bart i would love to see some pics of your car if that would be possible.
 

Edmond

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 1, 2001
Messages
5,218
Location
Louisiana
Corvette
2003 Z06
Ditch the stock wimpy exhaust system and you'll get a noticeable gain. Also, cut the air filter lid, put in a K&N and you'll get a gain. If you can, get headers, those are a big gain. In fact, redo the whole exhaust system from headers to mufflers and you'll be quite pleased. The stock L98 exhaust only flows through one outlet on each muffler. It's a very restrictive system. Not only do you gain better flow, you also gain the sound that a lot of people enjoy in a big V8.
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
I agree the exhaust is a good place to start. Do you have a manual or a slush box for a tranny. Some autos had really high gearing and you can get a big gain with a gear change. The best way to make cheap horsepower is Nitrous you can throw a 100 shot on it for about $600.00 that is a lot of power for the money spent.
Here is the pictures that you ask for. http://www.villagephotos.com/pubbrowse.asp?folder_id=1535340
 

davec0_17

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 7, 2006
Messages
164
Location
Houston, PA
Corvette
1994 black 6 speed, cat back flowmasters
First off you will not get 300hp from 8lbs. boost especially not with stock heads and cam. I don't recall what the 86 had but about 240 so with 8lbs if you are Lucky you could see a 125hp increase.
Doesnt this add up to 365 hp???:confused
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
davec0_17 said:
First off you will not get 300hp from 8lbs. boost especially not with stock heads and cam. I don't recall what the 86 had but about 240 so with 8lbs if you are Lucky you could see a 125hp increase.
Doesnt this add up to 365 hp???:confused
Yes it would but are we talking about what gain the boost will make or total hp.
I'm talking gain that you will get from 8 lbs of boost.
Most people think that more boost is more power but that is not always the case that is why I mentioned the head and cam because boost at the intake is nothing more than restriction in the induction system. If you replace the stock heads with a good aftermarket head and install a blower grind cam and use the same blower the boost will drop and the horsepower will go up.
What is important is not how much boost you can make in the intake manifold but how much pressure you can get into the cylinder.
 

kiwi vet

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
247
Location
New Zealand
Corvette
1981 Black/Camel T Top "RAC3R"
Other options maybe?

Not sure if I agree with all thats been said about boost, but its in the right direction.
Precise turbo charging is a rather more complex subject than can be dealt with in a chat room forum such as this, but there are options for you.

If you want learn from a real expert in turbo knowledge, I suggest Corky Bell's Turbo book, "Maximum Boost" as an fairly detailed initiation of the whole process.

If you just want a kit to fit your car, without having to learn it all, check out Gale Banks Engineering, I believe thier twin turbo kit and turbo prepped motor produce 640bhp total on 91 octane fuel un-intercooled, quite an acheivement. Look under thier twin turbo power guide online.

The more research you do, the more informed decisions you make.
The better the result!

Good Luck

:beer Grant
 

Edmond

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 1, 2001
Messages
5,218
Location
Louisiana
Corvette
2003 Z06
If you're going to do heads/cam anyway, why not just build the motor and forget about the plumbing on FI?

How about something like a 383?
 

kiwi vet

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
247
Location
New Zealand
Corvette
1981 Black/Camel T Top "RAC3R"
Edmond said:
If you're going to do heads/cam anyway, why not just build the motor and forget about the plumbing on FI?

How about something like a 383?

Edmond, your not talking about a turbo and a carb in the same sentance are you? ;LOL ;LOL ;LOL

:beer Grant
 

ptorlax18

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
32
Location
Deer Park, Long Island
Corvette
1986 Silver and Black Coupe
i do have a whole new exhaust from teh header back i woulf like to get new headers i havent found a nice set yet i just recently saw a bassani set but i dot know how much. ...Before thinking about the turbo i did think about replacing teh motor i found a company that make a direct drop in (yea right) a 350 taht puts out 350 supposedly ..its automatic and i really dont feel like screwing around with teh gear box i know alot can be gained from it but liek i said i am in college and i go back to school and i dont wanna leave it in pieces for teh winter
 

ptorlax18

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Messages
32
Location
Deer Park, Long Island
Corvette
1986 Silver and Black Coupe
the motor is located on smedingperformance.com its the 350 magnum tell me what you think
 

Edmond

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 1, 2001
Messages
5,218
Location
Louisiana
Corvette
2003 Z06
kiwi vet said:
Edmond, your not talking about a turbo and a carb in the same sentance are you? ;LOL ;LOL ;LOL

:beer Grant

Carb? We have fuel injection in America now. :L:L:L
 

kiwi vet

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
247
Location
New Zealand
Corvette
1981 Black/Camel T Top "RAC3R"
Read more carefully

Edmond said:
Carb? We have fuel injection in America now. :L:L:L

Sorry Edmond I thought you meant not plumbing on FI, Fuel Injection, I never was good at that speed reading thing.;LOL;LOL;LOL

:beer Grant
 

Edmond

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 1, 2001
Messages
5,218
Location
Louisiana
Corvette
2003 Z06
Grant, I don't think it's the speed reading, I think it's the :beer
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
KIWI VETTE Not sure if I agree with all thats been said about boost, but its in the right direction.

Please elaborate what part about boost is it that you don't agree with.
It would be my guess that it is when I said that you can in some instances show less boost and make more power.
Most people don't understand that part of it. While increasing the boost will result in more power it is because at the higher boost pressure you have increased the flow and it is all about flow. So when you change heads and cam and increase the flow the boost (pressure) will drop but the flow will increase. The object is to increase the amount of air that is going into the engine. That can be accomplished by increasing the boost or improving the engines ability to breath. The later will cause a drop in boost but make more power than higher boost on a severely restricted induction system like found on a stock production automobile. After changing the heads you can install a bigger blower that has more air flow and the boost will increase and so will the power. Remember that the only way that a blower can build boost is to flow more air than the engine can use. If the engine consumes more air then the boost will drop and then you will need a bigger blower to get the boost back up.
While more boost will always mean more power in some instances you can also see a loss in boost and make more power because the engine is consuming the air not just building boost in the intake manifold. This is the one thing that a lot of people don't understand about forced induction.
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
kiwi vet said:
Black Bart
Im not saying your theory/practical application is incorrect, however there are some issues you raised that I dont agree with.

1
And that would be ?????????
 

kiwi vet

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2005
Messages
247
Location
New Zealand
Corvette
1981 Black/Camel T Top "RAC3R"
Clarification

Black Bart
Firstly I agree with most of what you said, and Im not trying to be inflamatory and get ito any sort of technobabble arguement.
However, when I mentioned Im not sure I agree with all thats been said about boost, pertains particularly to this underlined section........
quote

"Most people think that more boost is more power but that is not always the case that is why I mentioned the head and cam because boost at the intake is nothing more than restriction in the induction system"

This is incorrect.....
Boost cannot be a restriction in the in the induction system, however the induction system (including manifold, heads and port size) can be a restriction to effective use of the boost available (available flow).

Secondly..... your reply today....

"While more boost will always mean more power" (your statement. and if the system has been designed properly , I totally agree)

"in some instances you can also see a loss in boost and make more power" (your statement, but in the context, this has nothing to do with boost, but increased engine efficency)

The point Im trying to make is that this is a very complex subject, and therefore a lot of "urban myth" surrounding it.

My main recomendation to anyone contemplating this exercise would be to purchase the literature (as I had suggested) and understand the principals, apply the procedures, and receive the expected results.

Thanks for inviting me the chance to clarify my post, and I totally agree with you...........................If It's not Blown, it SUCKS!

:beer Grant
 
B

Black Bart

Guest
Grant that is why I was trying to get you to state what you did not agree with because you are saying the same thing that I did but i think your wording is better. More boost is because of the engine inability to consume all available air flow thus creating boost
My advice to the original poster is wait until you are out of college.
before undertaking a project like this.
 

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