Proper scanner and adaptors

[tideman7]

I own a 1993 Black Rose finish 40th anniversary Corvette. Rather my wife owns it. I just get to work on it. I have been researching finding the proper code scanner and cartridges for this car. My FSM references the Vetronix Tech 1 but all the one's I have found on auction sites list cartridges up to 1992. Trying not to break the bank but need a reliable test set for this car. Any suggestions?

 

[Hib Halverson]

I own a 1993 Black Rose finish 40th anniversary Corvette. Rather my wife owns it. I just get to work on it. I have been researching finding the proper code scanner and cartridges for this car. My FSM references the Vetronix Tech 1 but all the one's I have found on auction sites list cartridges up to 1992. Trying not to break the bank but need a reliable test set for this car. Any suggestions?

What you want is a TECH-1A not a TECH-1. If you want full diagnostic capability you need engine, chassis and body cartridges for that device. The "T-1A" is a good piece of equipment, but it does have two problems 1) a two-line screen and 2) it is no longer supported, ie: there is no service or parts available.

It is likely you can get by with just the ability to scan the engine controls, there are aftermarket scan tools which might be a better choice. Actron is a good brand.

For more information on scan test equipment, see these articles on the CAC:
Corvette Action Center | Tech | A Dose of Digital: Part 1 - The Basics - Page 1 of 5
Corvette Action Center | Tech | A Dose of Digital: Part 2 - Diagnostic Tool Buyer's Guide - Page 1 of 4

Lastly, if you are to the point that you are purchasing a scan tester, you'll also need the Factory Service Manual. CAC sponsor Zip Products sells them. Corvette Parts & Corvette Accessories: Zip Products - Since 1977

 

[tideman7]

What you want is a TECH-1A not a TECH-1. If you want full diagnostic capability you need engine, chassis and body cartridges for that device. The "T-1A" is a good piece of equipment, but it does have two problems 1) a two-line screen and 2) it is no longer supported, ie: there is no service or parts available.

It is likely you can get by with just the ability to scan the engine controls, there are aftermarket scan tools which might be a better choice. Actron is a good brand.

For more information on scan test equipment, see these articles on the CAC:
Corvette Action Center | Tech | A Dose of Digital: Part 1 - The Basics - Page 1 of 5
Corvette Action Center | Tech | A Dose of Digital: Part 2 - Diagnostic Tool Buyer's Guide - Page 1 of 4

Lastly, if you are to the point that you are purchasing a scan tester, you'll also need the Factory Service Manual. CAC sponsor Zip Products sells them. Corvette Parts & Corvette Accessories: Zip Products - Since 1977

Great info. I appreciate the answer and will check out these sources. I already have my manuals and that ofcourse keeps referencing the tech 1. I have heard of the 1A and will start looking at that and the alternatives you have offered.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Great info. I appreciate the answer and will check out these sources. I already have my manuals and that ofcourse keeps referencing the tech 1. I have heard of the 1A and will start looking at that and the alternatives you have offered.

Glad to be of service.

I just noticed your color. Is your 93 a ZR-1?

 

[tideman7]

Glad to be of service.

I just noticed your color. Is your 93 a ZR-1?

Nope. LT-1. My wife owned it before I met her. Since I have become her mechanic lately after some disasterous shop experiences I have read about the ZR-1. I think I could really get in to that machine. The six speed manual tranny impresses me.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Nope. LT-1. (snip)

Dark Rose is a color, no matter what's under the hood.

Moderator(s) if you're reading, since the issue at hand is not ZR-1-specific, why not move this post to the C4 Technical forum where it will get a wider response.

 

[toptechx6]

Tech 1 VS. Tech 1-A

Actually the only difference between a Tech 1 and a Tech 1-A is that the Tech 1-A has two additional ports not present on the Tech 1. The RS232 port was for communication between the scan tool and the dealership Cams computer system or printer, addition of adapter TK5030 allowed the Tech 1 to perform the same functions. The second port missing from the Tech 1 is a connection for a voltage probe. This function is easily performed with a regular Digital Volt Ohm Meter (DVOM), which is a basic diagnostic tool necessary for any electrical or diagnostic testing anyway.

Point being that you should not pass up a Tech 1 if you find one at a reasonable price, it will perform all tests described in the Factory Service Manual including bidirectional operation of solenoids and relays. RS232 communication is essentially obsolete unless you find a Cams computer of feel the need to print results.

What is far more important for either tool is getting a Mass Storage Cartridge PN 30000003 loaded with the final software developed for the C4 , those versions listed below.


Mass Storage Version 3.2
Powertrain 3.0
Body 1.9
Chassis 1.8
Programming 4.0
ABS 2.0

With the MSC listed above NO other cartridges will be needed as it incorporates all earlier versions and can test any C4 system as long as you have the correct cable adapters for your application. I can suggest the correct adapters needed for your application and have original GM Tech 1 operation manuals for Powertrain, Chassis, and Body in PDF format that I will happily share with anyone who contacts me by PM.

It is true that manufacturer Vetronix/Bosch no longer supports these scan tools, they do still supply many of the cartridges and adapters however since they also fit newer tools such as MTS 3100, see this link Diagnostics Parts & Accessories they are quite expensive if purchased from Bosch. One benefit for the home mechanic is that many of the accessories are now available at low cost on Ebay since GM dealers have replaced the Tech 1 and Tech 1-A with newer scan tools, hope that helps.

 

[tideman7]

Thanks for the great info. You cleared up the mystery of the MSC. I hope I have not made a mistake but I have ordered a Actron 9190 scanner as it is supposed to cover OBD2 and OBD1 for GM, Ford and Crysler I think. I got a little discouraged when I went looking for a Tech 1A and did not find too many. You basically explained the difference and it appears a Tech1 would have fit the bill.

Actually the only difference between a Tech 1 and a Tech 1-A is that the Tech 1-A has two additional ports not present on the Tech 1. The RS232 port was for communication between the scan tool and the dealership Cams computer system or printer, addition of adapter TK5030 allowed the Tech 1 to perform the same functions. The second port missing from the Tech 1 is a connection for a voltage probe. This function is easily performed with a regular Digital Volt Ohm Meter (DVOM), which is a basic diagnostic tool necessary for any electrical or diagnostic testing anyway.

Point being that you should not pass up a Tech 1 if you find one at a reasonable price, it will perform all tests described in the Factory Service Manual including bidirectional operation of solenoids and relays. RS232 communication is essentially obsolete unless you find a Cams computer of feel the need to print results.

What is far more important for either tool is getting a Mass Storage Cartridge PN 30000003 loaded with the final software developed for the C4 , those versions listed below.


Mass Storage Version 3.2
Powertrain 3.0
Body 1.9
Chassis 1.8
Programming 4.0
ABS 2.0

With the MSC listed above NO other cartridges will be needed as it incorporates all earlier versions and can test any C4 system as long as you have the correct cable adapters for your application. I can suggest the correct adapters needed for your application and have original GM Tech 1 operation manuals for Powertrain, Chassis, and Body in PDF format that I will happily share with anyone who contacts me by PM.

It is true that manufacturer Vetronix/Bosch no longer supports these scan tools, they do still supply many of the cartridges and adapters however since they also fit newer tools such as MTS 3100, see this link Diagnostics Parts & Accessories they are quite expensive if purchased from Bosch. One benefit for the home mechanic is that many of the accessories are now available at low cost on Ebay since GM dealers have replaced the Tech 1 and Tech 1-A with newer scan tools, hope that helps.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Generally, I think "toptechx6" has a better understanding of the current TECH 1A market than I do.

If you can't find an MSC, remember the software versions "toptechxt6" lists above. If an eBay item is and "old style" software cartridge and not an MSC, if the description doesn't list the version numbers, ask the seller. If they can't tell you, you might want to carefully consider bidding.

I will add that, I worked directly with Vetronix from 1986 until the company was sold to Bosch and I've continued a working relationship with the Bosch Diagnostics folks. I just spoke to my contact there in re: the old T1 and T1A. While it is true that one hardware difference between T1 and T1A is Series A added the instrumentation and RS232 ports, as "toptechx6" points out, the need for those, in the real world, is not great, unless you want to print results. My earlier suggestion that it's important to buy a T1A rather than a T1 is, really, not very important as long as you don't need to print stuff or view the data on a PC running the ancient Vetronix software called "Techview". Sorry for the confusion.

There is, however, one other difference between the T1 and the T1A. When I spoke to my contact Bosch Diagnostics just a bit ago--he's one of the few people left in tech support who was there when it was still Vetronix Corp--he reminded me that the data cables are not the same and are not interchangeable so, if you buy the T1 make sure it comes with its original data cable. If the cable is missing, don't buy the tester because no cables are available.

"toptechx6's" suggestion to look for an MSC is a very good one, especially if you want to diagnose all the controllers on the car, rather than just the powertrain controller. Good point!

As for software and adapters, the situation might not be quite as "toptechx6" suggests. As of today, Bosch has no software cartridges for T1/T1A other than MSCs and the only cables and adapters still available are a few parts which, also, fit the MTS3100 Mastertech and that Bosch still has in stock. Lastly, with respect to the MTS3100, it is now "obsolete" with the final software revision being released two weeks ago which supports some 2012 model GM vehicles.

 

[tideman7]

I mentioned above I have ordered the Actron 9190 scanner. I hope it does close to the tech1. This all started because I am chasing a DTC 26 code. I understand from other posts that it is a Quad Driver fault. It senses four solenoids. I have replaced the EGR solenoid and have put in a new battery. Thought the EGR solenoid was shorted out. After going back and testing it with VOM several days later it appears open (infinity). Either way I still have the code. I hope the new scanner will help me replace the correct part this time. My FSM does not appear to have a diagnostic proceedure for the DTC 26.

 

[toptechx6]

I mentioned above I have ordered the Actron 9190 scanner. I hope it does close to the tech1. This all started because I am chasing a DTC 26 code. I understand from other posts that it is a Quad Driver fault. It senses four solenoids. I have replaced the EGR solenoid and have put in a new battery. Thought the EGR solenoid was shorted out. After going back and testing it with VOM several days later it appears open (infinity). Either way I still have the code. I hope the new scanner will help me replace the correct part this time. My FSM does not appear to have a diagnostic proceedure for the DTC 26.

I have a similar scan tool by Autoxray, they work fine for pulling and erasing codes and reading the data stream and they are capable of accessing our old cars and newer OBDII stuff too. Unfortunately they lack many features such as bidirectional capability and the ability to access other controllers, the ECM or Powertrain is all they can see. Those features are the huge advantage of the Tech 1.

Your code 26 is a good example of how helpful bidirectional capability can be, using the tool you can actuate each solenoid in turn, the one that doesn't click is the culprit. Correct diagnosis would still require verifying that wiring is okay before replacing parts, but the ability to actuate solenoids and relays can really speed up the isolation process.

I will post the diagnostic pages for code 26 from my 93 Factory Service Manual, you can do the tests the old fashioned way using your DVOM. I have found many failed purge solenoids, a quick test is to simply take an ohm reading across the two terminals of the solenoid, if it is open (infinite resistance) it is bad, good luck and be sure to post your results.

 

[toptechx6]

Generally, I think "toptechx6" has a better understanding of the current TECH 1A market than I do.

If you can't find an MSC, remember the software versions "toptechxt6" lists above. If an eBay item is and "old style" software cartridge and not an MSC, if the description doesn't list the version numbers, ask the seller. If they can't tell you, you might want to carefully consider bidding.

I will add that, I worked directly with Vetronix from 1986 until the company was sold to Bosch and I've continued a working relationship with the Bosch Diagnostics folks. I just spoke to my contact there in re: the old T1 and T1A. While it is true that one hardware difference between T1 and T1A is Series A added the instrumentation and RS232 ports, as "toptechx6" points out, the need for those, in the real world, is not great, unless you want to print results. My earlier suggestion that it's important to buy a T1A rather than a T1 is, really, not very important as long as you don't need to print stuff or view the data on a PC running the ancient Vetronix software called "Techview". Sorry for the confusion.

There is, however, one other difference between the T1 and the T1A. When I spoke to my contact Bosch Diagnostics just a bit ago--he's one of the few people left in tech support who was there when it was still Vetronix Corp--he reminded me that the data cables are not the same and are not interchangeable so, if you buy the T1 make sure it comes with its original data cable. If the cable is missing, don't buy the tester because no cables are available.

"toptechx6's" suggestion to look for an MSC is a very good one, especially if you want to diagnose all the controllers on the car, rather than just the powertrain controller. Good point!

As for software and adapters, the situation might not be quite as "toptechx6" suggests. As of today, Bosch has no software cartridges for T1/T1A other than MSCs and the only cables and adapters still available are a few parts which, also, fit the MTS3100 Mastertech and that Bosch still has in stock. Lastly, with respect to the MTS3100, it is now "obsolete" with the final software revision being released two weeks ago which supports some 2012 model GM vehicles.

Hib, thanks for the updated information concerning cartridges and adapters, I was going by the Bosch website in my link and it seems to show several are still available for purchase as accessories for their MTS 3100. I will note the changes indicated by your contact. As mentioned in my first post buying direct from Bosch is something I would only consider after failing to find what I need on Ebay.
Thanks too for pointing out the difference between the cables for Tech 1 and Tech 1-A, you are of course correct that they are not interchangeable between tools. That makes no difference from a functional standpoint, but as you mentioned it is critical if you are considering purchase of one that has no cable.

 

[tideman7]

Ok. I am a little dissappointed. I thought the Actron could turn these solenoids off and on. Oh well. I needed a good OBD2 scanner as well. I will keep my eye out for a tech1. Thanks

I have a similar scan tool by Autoxray, they work fine for pulling and erasing codes and reading the data stream and they are capable of accessing our old cars and newer OBDII stuff too. Unfortunately they lack many features such as bidirectional capability and the ability to access other controllers, the ECM or Powertrain is all they can see. Those features are the huge advantage of the Tech 1.

Your code 26 is a good example of how helpful bidirectional capability can be, using the tool you can actuate each solenoid in turn, the one that doesn't click is the culprit. Correct diagnosis would still require verifying that wiring is okay before replacing parts, but the ability to actuate solenoids and relays can really speed up the isolation process.

I will post the diagnostic pages for code 26 from my 93 Factory Service Manual, you can do the tests the old fashioned way using your DVOM. I have found many failed purge solenoids, a quick test is to simply take an ohm reading across the two terminals of the solenoid, if it is open (infinite resistance) it is bad, good luck and be sure to post your results.

 

[tideman7]

Not sure if this posted or not. Sorry if it is repeated. Still getting used to the workings of the Forum.

Ok. I am a little dissappointed. I thought the Actron could turn these solenoids off and on. Oh well. I needed a good OBD2 scanner as well. I will keep my eye out for a tech1. Thanks

 

[toptechx6]

Not sure if this posted or not. Sorry if it is repeated. Still getting used to the workings of the Forum.

Ok. I am a little dissappointed. I thought the Actron could turn these solenoids off and on. Oh well. I needed a good OBD2 scanner as well. I will keep my eye out for a tech1. Thanks

The key word is bidirectional, if the scan tool does not specify that feature it lacks the ability to operate solenoids and relays. It only receives information from the PCM it cannot command it to operate anything, thus all flow is in one direction.
Most consumer grade scan tools function the same way, professional tools that can do so are far more expensive. I am located in south Florida if you happen to be nearby, you are welcome to use my Tech 1, just send me a PM.

 

[93Rubie]

Lots of good info here. Don't expect ANY consumer grade scan tool to give you bidirectional control. I have a entry level professional grade scan tool and it does not have bidirectional control, but it does do ABS, Air Bag, etc....You need a middle grade or high end professional grade tool to do most bidirectional stuff. Long story short, bring $$$$ if you want that capability. Or find a decently priced Tech1/1A on the used market. Good Luck.

FYI, a lot of time you can test things without the use of the scan tool it just makes it easier. In some cases there is NO WAY around NOT using one with bidirectional control to diagnose an issue. However, for the average owner/consumer this is a very rare event.

 

[Hib Halverson]

I've done a fair amount of research on scan testers. To my knowledge there is no hardware-based, consumer-priced scan tester capable of bi-directional communication.

You have to look to professional grade hardware to get bi-directional communication in a tester.

Some of the software-based scan testers, such as EASE, may have some bi-directional ability.

 

[tideman7]

Thanks for all the info from everyone. I will keep looking for a good old Tech 1. Thanks toptechx6 for the offer but I am in West Central GA. I will post my findings later.

 

[tideman7]

Hib,
Looking at a Mastertech. What cards and adaptors are needed for my corvette? One of the cards says it is a Multifunction Tester 12MB Pro Card. Does not mention a mass storage cartridge.

 

[tideman7]

Here is the total list:

Multifunction Tester 12MB Pro Card•Nissan/Infiniti 12MB Pro Card
•Chrysler Engine/CCD Vehicle Interface Module V2
•Vehicle Interface Module VER 2
•OBDII Controller Area Network Vehicle Interface Module
•Diagnostics Test Lead Adapter
•Wires/Adapters Shown In Picture
•Technicians Manual
•Carrying Case
RJF103