85 no crank, no start

[ddvette]

I'm a new member, but have been using the knowledge base and gained alot of info. Here' my problem... I replaced spark plug wires a couple of months and saw a great running difference, but about 2 weeks ago I got a really unexpected start and stall condition when trying to leave work. Got it running enought to get home (limping and backfiring) and put it in my garage to see what was up. Starting by cleaning the TB and plenum and while in there replaced vacuum hoses, EGR valve, IAC. Since it's winter here, I decided to do the fuel filter and fuel pump. Same results - start and immediately stall. Took the starter out and cleaned connections. Didn't think it had anything to do with my current problem, but that's when I caused more trouble.

I had the starter looked at at the local parts place - they said it was ok, but started "chattering" while on their test machine. I put it back in, but wasn't convinced that it was good. Since then I've had a no start, no click, no crank condition. Before I take it to my mechanic, I decided to replace the starter (AC DELCO). Same condition (no start, no click, no crank).

Anyone have similar experiences?

Thanks

 

[JonM]

Check your Crank Fuse
Make sure battery fully charged
Make sure terminals + and - clean
Make sure transmission fully in park (or clutch in fully)
Unlock the two doors with the key (could be alarm related)
Are you getting any trouble codes?
BE CAREFUL DOING THIS...take a piece of wire with an alligator clip on one end...hook it onto the small terminal on the starter. Then tap the other end of the wire on the starters large terminal. See what happens. JUST TAP IT ..see if it engages starter.


When you removed the starter...did you check all the wires for corrosion or plastic insulation on the wire that was brittle? It gets hot in that area and wires can deteriorate and short out.

The starter wires also have fusible links, check for continuity using an ohms meter.

Let us know when you have done these

 

[ddvette]

I'll just go down your list.

Did some stuff with a multimeter:
Don't know where the crank fuse is.
Batter is relatively new and charged (showing 12.2v)
Also the wires at the starter show the same reading
Terminals and connections just cleaned
It's a manual (clutch was in)
I get no trouble codes.
None of the wires connected to or going to the starter are brittle.
I'll unlock the doors as you said and try jumping the terminals.

Right now the starter is on the floor. I'll be back when I get it re-installed.

Thanks a lot.

 

[vigman]

Ignore the VATS portion! ( 85 no start)

From a OLD post... but needed info for YOU!


Starter relay wiring/VATS

BZZZTTTTTT Disagree with Chris on this one!
( Oh no a conflict.........)


You Could have toasted the contacts on the starter interupt relay.

SO

The relay is located behind the DIC ( Drivers informational console ) in the center part of the dash... behind the console is the Alarm fuse and your HORN relay & the starter interupt relay.
(LARGE GAUGE WIRE @ RELAY)

The yellow line (Pin E) is the feed from the key switch.
Relay pinouts:
The Dark Green White(PIN A) is the relay output heading twds the Clutch saftey switch ( or the tranny switch in the case of an automatic )

FOR A QUICK TEST ONLY!!!!!!
JUMP PINS A&E with a BIG paperclip and just BLIP the key ( Clutch in ) the paperclip will HEAT UP...DANGER about 10 amps of current!
If the Starter pulls in... TADA!.. replace the relay.

If not...continue....

The output of either of these switches is a purple wire which goes 2 places
1 to the starter post
2 to the fuse box and the START/CRANK line is the power for the cold start injector!

The Crank fuse is in the fuse box ( on pass side dash)


Now It's MY opinion.....

If you turn the key to Start
and you hear a CLICK behind the dash DIC panel.
BUT the starter doesn't spin.....

The VATS is OK BUT the relay is TOAST


SO.. back to the starter interupt relay.

The COIL of the relay
Pin C Yellow ( Hot in crank)
Pin B Dk Green ( Grounded when VATS is HAPPY)

You should hear this relay CLICK.... if you are unsure... use a test light and get across the b&c pins.... if the light lights Vats is happy!

Betting you starter was OK and the relay pooped out!

Vig!

 

[vigman]

So in an 85....

I believe it's like an 84 where the starter intrerupt relay is hooked to the ALARM and not the vats.....

The big purple wire at the starter is the solenoid engage line.

While you have the starter out...just replace it with a GOOD Delco..not a PEP BOYS or other cheepie!


This post SHOULD be in the C-4 section..I almost missed it!


Vig!

 

[ddvette]

latest

Starter back in.. all connections tight. Something I had forgotten until I tried to restart. I get one shot at the ignition and the entire car dies (no lights, no instrument panel, nothing). On the first turn of the key this time, I heard a loud click (may have been two) from the starter (I think). After everything goes out, I can disconnect the battery, reconnect the battery and try again, but if I keep the batter terminal connected, all electrical seems to be dead.

more thanks

 

[ddvette]

Good Delco

Your comment about a "cheepie" starter...

It is an AC DELCO, but I got it at Advance Auto Parts. Do you know of a problem with them?

thx

 

[JonM]

Did you check the Crank Fuse?
Did you jump the starter?

You need to check the clutch start switch and the relay switch. You can jump the clutch under the drivers side hush pad. (use appropriate gage wire) And as Vigman suggested you need to check the relay. (behind the center bezel) I'll include a pic below, jump the purple and the green/white wire.



Pic Here