BEWARE OF Corvette City Denver Co.\ Gary Steffens

[Wilkinshc]

Please, please, please .... do not ever file a complaint with any agency as a mechanism for revenge.

We have quite enough to deal with already, and while you are laughing at how you screwed them up for a few hours by making them deal with me keep in mind that someone reporting a real problem got neglected while I was acting as your personal "avenger".

BTW .... on the downside for you may be a complaint for harassment.

If you left your name with OSHA, and I am quite suprised that they even went out (if you didn't?), did you get a follow up "call" from the investigator? I sure don't work for OSHA, but when six agencies show up on bogus complaints there may additional follow up. You are the reason that many agencies won't even respond without leaving a valid phone number or tracable e-address.

Just as an aside and on topic; the "crinklng" of the coating does look like the work of paint stripper and though I am not familiar with powder coatings, I'd still wager a guess, that if there was enough surface contamination at the shop of origin, that would have been noticed right away, not after the parts had been installed. That appears to be a lot of crinkling ... !!

65-to-00,

First, I don't think your initial comments were aimed at me.

I did file with the BBB and asked them to forward it to the Attorney General. I do think people in the future should know how I was treated. I sent a 5 page statement, and copies of emails on what happened. I kept it factual, and made a point not to be over-emotional. I do not know that they damaged the powdercoating intentionally, but I do believe it happened in their possesion. I am sure that it was not poor powdercoating, I have had the parts for over a year and when assembled there was no evidence of peeling. Parts that are peeling were powdercoated at different places (frame locally, Trailing arms from Tom's Differential). The Body was put on 2 days before taking it to Corvette City and I just torqued all the bolts on the suspension, checked the fuel line and brake line fittings and I would have definitely seen it. I also did not see it when strapping the car in to the enclosed trailer to deliver it to them. It was their responsibility to protect my property while in their care; they did not.

I am not trying to be vengeful, but I was shocked about what happened considering that they were listed in Corvette Fever as a Trusted Shop. People need to be aware of the risk they take with having their car at his shop. And if this is the trend with this shop, the BBB and Attorney General have documentation to refer to.


Chuck

 

[65-to-00]

Comments were regarding the post above by JimVette regarding the Goodyear dealership where he called EPA, OSHA and even the Fire Inspector.

No fan of Goodyear since our local dealer here is on my list of "bad mouth every chance I get" .... I just don't holler "fire" over a few bad alignment jobs.

Sorry for any confusion.

Allow me to try to take some of the sting out of this for you. When you are done, you will have one hell of a car. When I go out to the garage ... my black "00" still hasn't magically transformed into a "65"!

Note that my "65-to-00" is that a looooooooooong time ago I had a 65 ... but someday when I grow up again.

 

[fine69]

I do think you should consider yourself lucky, your car have easily been stolen. At least you now have your car back safe and sound!

I'm sorry to hear of your horrible experience.

 

[OSU-VETTE]

Boy, I absolutely feel for the pain you are going through, it makes me realize what a gem the Corvette Action Center is, and why word of mouth is so important when placing your car in the hands of "professionals".

I am in Columbus, OH and the chassis/body shop with the best reputation around for chassis work is closing down, and the primary reason is the guy had too much work and couldn't handle it. It is first and foremost a business for our treasured mechanics, and each of us relying on each other for reputation is the golden. That said, I don't know the history of this shop, he may have had the best rep around, and flaked out. Good luck with the rest of your restoration, I am glad to see you have the car back and have done an outstanding job of not being personal in your correspondence as well as not retaliating, you are very even headed, again good luck, cannot wait to see it finished.

 

[65-StingRay]

Chuck,

I just finished reading all the posts on this thread. I like the way you controlled your anger over this mess. The letter you sent was BANG ON. You explained your postion and what your expectations were. Good on ya.

I hope that ZL-1 engine is undamaged.

Hope everything works out and you get back your $2500.00. I know you've got a lot tied up in that project and I know I'd really like to see your finished product.

Good Luck
Regards,

65-StingRay
Wayne

 

[XLR8]

Chuck,

I'll add my "well done" for your responsible actions and keeping your temper in check also. You seem to have handled the situation in a commendable manner.

The Corvette Action Center is a great place to pass word to other Corvette owners about vendors - good or bad. And the BBB contact is an excellent idea. When I find myself forced to deal with someone whose reputation is unknown to me, or I don't know of anyone personally who has done business with them, I always check them out with the BBB first.

Sorry to hear about your problems. I hope they're resolved to your satisfaction soon.

Jane Ann

 

[Wilkinshc]

I really appreciate the support! I decided to start on it again tomorrow. I'm going to lift the body off, take the valve covers off (video taping with witness), and drop the rearend.

Monday I will call Tom's Differential and ask if they would be willing to build me a new trailing arm, send it to me and credit me for the one I'll send back minus cost for recoating, disassembling, and reassembling.

After a day or two of calming, I cleaned it up today and the damage was limited to differential cover, diff. crossmember, trailing arm, and one spot on the frame about the size of a 3" circle. I did wipe it down the first night I got home but got more detailed today.

Now that I am taking it apart, I am really considering an SRIII frame but I might just use something like POR-15 on the frame spot and recoat the rearend pieces. That way I could have it ready for a body shop again in a couple of weeks.

If anyone hears of someone looking for a c2 frame, VBP front suspension, steeroids pwr rack, and some stock rear suspension please let me know.


Chuck

 

[firstgear]

I really appreciate the support! I decided to start on it again tomorrow. I'm going to lift the body off, take the valve covers off (video taping with witness), and drop the rearend.

Monday I will call Tom's Differential and ask if they would be willing to build me a new trailing arm, send it to me and credit me for the one I'll send back minus cost for recoating, disassembling, and reassembling.

After a day or two of calming, I cleaned it up today and the damage was limited to differential cover, diff. crossmember, trailing arm, and one spot on the frame about the size of a 3" circle. I did wipe it down the first night I got home but got more detailed today.

Now that I am taking it apart, I am really considering an SRIII frame but I might just use something like POR-15 on the frame spot and recoat the rearend pieces. That way I could have it ready for a body shop again in a couple of weeks.

If anyone hears of someone looking for a c2 frame, VBP front suspension, steeroids pwr rack, and some stock rear suspension please let me know.


Chuck

Maybe he did you a favor if you are now reconsidering everything and going to a SRIII frame.....good luck with what ever you do, you will be pleased for sure!

 

[Wilkinshc]

Maybe he did you a favor if you are now reconsidering everything and going to a SRIII frame.....good luck with what ever you do, you will be pleased for sure!

There is always a positive way to look at everything.

 

[JimVette]

Please, please, please .... do not ever file a complaint with any agency as a mechanism for revenge.

We have quite enough to deal with already, and while you are laughing at how you screwed them up for a few hours by making them deal with me keep in mind that someone reporting a real problem got neglected while I was acting as your personal "avenger".

BTW .... on the downside for you may be a complaint for harassment.

If you left your name with OSHA, and I am quite suprised that they even went out (if you didn't?), did you get a follow up "call" from the investigator? I sure don't work for OSHA, but when six agencies show up on bogus complaints there may additional follow up. You are the reason that many agencies won't even respond without leaving a valid phone number or tracable e-address.

Just as an aside and on topic; the "crinklng" of the coating does look like the work of paint stripper and though I am not familiar with powder coatings, I'd still wager a guess, that if there was enough surface contamination at the shop of origin, that would have been noticed right away, not after the parts had been installed. That appears to be a lot of crinkling ... !!

First of all let me say that except for OSHA every complaint I filed with every agency was justified. My original response was to make a long story short. The reason I was so pi**ed was I told them how and where to break down the tires and they chose to ignore me, even when I pointed out the decals on the wheels stating how and where. The managers position was the sensors were broken off before I drove my ZR1 to there store and that was where he made his stand. This store was corporate owned and when I contacted Akron before filing my complaints they offered me $.50 on the dollar for the repair costs. Take it or leave it. So I dealt with them in the language they understood. By the way, after the arbitration (small claims court) the new store manager apoligized and said it should never have gone this far. As I told him, "you did it to yourselves."

The OSHA, (not knowing any better), was an excess, but I was on a roll.

 

[Tom Bryant]

This sort of thing is a real nightmare. I have a feeling it is going to be like pulling teeth to get your $2500. back even with litigation involved. If he really did get the fenders for your car and they are what you want you may need to negotiate a settlement with him that would result in you getting the fenders and whatever he had made for your car.

You or someone acting in your behalf are going to have to talk to him again to settle this. Did he do any work on the car that he can rightfully charge you for? Maybe you can get the parts and some of your money back. If you reach an agreement with him. I'd post asking for a CAC member in the Denver area (there are many) that would pick up the parts and ship them to you. That way you would have someone on the ground there that could see that you are actually getting what you want and be sure that the parts were shipped.

The pattern on the frame looks like your tire ran over a container of stripper or some other chemical when the car was beeing rolled around in the shop. It was probably accidental but why wasn't it flushed off as soon as it was discovered? If it wasn't intentional it was neglect in caring for your property while in their care. I spent a lot of years in body shops and accidents do happen that result in damage to areas of a car that we had no intention of working on. We just had to fix it at our expense and write it off.

Good luck with getting this resolved.

 

[vettefinderjim]

Not a NCRS car, but their body guys understand

There are a lot of long time NCRS guys in your town who do or know who does good glass work. Even a boat repair shop can do glass work.

And any short track 'race shop' like what the UNSER'S use can fabricated your roll cage.

Send me a private email at v.vettefinderjim@verizon.net and I will share names and numbers that should be able to help.
Regards,
JIM

 

[Wilkinshc]

There are a lot of long time NCRS guys in your town who do or know who does good glass work. Even a boat repair shop can do glass work.

And any short track 'race shop' like what the UNSER'S use can fabricated your roll cage.

Send me a private email at v.vettefinderjim@verizon.net and I will share names and numbers that should be able to help.
Regards,
JIM

Thanks Jim,

I sent an email.

Chuck

 

[RodsnRides]

Denver here...

Hey Chuck -

You need any help, let me know. I can pick up the fenders or whatever, no worries. I've never heard of these guys, but I have heard enough now.ad

Really like your project. That's gonna be one sweet beast.

Rick
:gap

 

[Wilkinshc]

Hey Chuck -

You need any help, let me know. I can pick up the fenders or whatever, no worries. I've never heard of these guys, but I have heard enough now.ad

Really like your project. That's gonna be one sweet beast.

Rick
:gap

Rick,

Thanks for the offer, as it stands now I have disputed the deposit on the Visa and they have credited for now.

I really did like their fenders and so far are the only place that sells the front fenders. A couple vendors sell the rears. I would like to buy them but I can not see spending one penny to keep that place in business.

Right now I am looking into finding someone to build molds for the front and back with a couple of changes.

I would like them a little wider, front turn signal built in, and the rear bottom fender to cover the wheel.

Again thanks for the offer.

Chuck

 

[RodsnRides]

No problem-happy to assist. I really like the fenders/glasswork on '67 Heaven's (Bob's) car, although I know you aren't shipping it to Canada. You might find out from him who built the flares, though. Just a thought.

Good to hear you have gotten a credit on your Visa. That shop won't be seeing me as a customer.

Would like to see photos of your finished beauty, which I am sure you will share here when the time comes. Good luck, and I hope everything works out well for you.

Rick
:gap

 

[Wilkinshc]

I really like the fenders/glasswork on '67 Heaven's (Bob's) car, although I know you aren't shipping it to Canada. You might find out from him who built the flares, though. Just a thought.

Rick
:gap

Rick,

He bought the flares for Corvette City but even he had some problems. Not to my extreme though.

Chuck

 

[rmonty]

Chuck,

I am a 4 year customer of Gary and Corvette City and will continue to be. I am one of hundreds, maybe thousands that have dealt with him for many years and are very satisfied with the services he provides. In fact, my car will be in his shop within the next 2 weeks to have them repair damage from an unfortunate incident where someone backed into and damaged the passenger side rear quarter panel. I have complete faith in Gary and his staff for repairs and to purchase parts as well.

This thread is very one sided and in my opinion, unfair to a shop that is well respected and in the Corvette world. Gary has been allowed to provide a response to these allegations on the “Corvette Forum > C1 & C2 Corvettes, 1953 - 1967 > C1 & C2 Corvettes” section. I would recommend that CAC members read the response and form their own opinion about this dispute.

I believe that using a forum like CAC to publicly attempt to trash a business is not what CAC is about. This is a great forum for the Corvette community. We need to be careful to make sure that what we post is factual. I don’t know if Gary has attempted to get registered on CAC so he can defend himself or not. I do know that on Corvette Forum he did try to register but ended up providing his response through the moderator.

The internet is a powerful tool but we need to remember that what you read on forums is usually one person’s opinion. There are always two sides to a story. When one of the sides isn’t presented, the “pack of wolfs syndrome” usually prevails at the other parties expense.

 

[vettefinderjim]

THERE ARE TWO SIDES TO EVERY STORY

There are a lot of long time NCRS guys in your town who do or know who does good glass work. Even a boat repair shop can do glass work.

And any short track 'race shop' like what the UNSER'S use can fabricated your roll cage.

Send me a private email at v.vettefinderjim@verizon.net and I will share names and numbers that should be able to help.
Regards,
JIM

I tried to help........and then got warned there are two sides to every story, and only one side has been explained here. My New Mexico friends (three in number) have all said that Gary has been in business for over 20 years supplying quality products and service. The exact words were:

"I have known Gary Steffans for years, and he is one of the most honest
and upstanding people I know. I have heard both sides
of the story now, and trust me, threr is more to the story"

So I concur........as old Rodney King said when the cops beat him up........CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG HERE ?

 

[Wilkinshc]

I would like the opportunity to respond one last time given the lengthy response by Gary. Let me start by saying Gary is quite an eloquent story-teller. I have kept emails which contradict his lengthy explanation. Following is an excerpt from one email in which he states the reason he left the afternoon I arrived to pick up my car is because he had to "run for parts", which he contradicts in this current rebuttal by stating that he had a dental appointment. ( I suppose it is quite hard to keep your stories straight when you tell so many.)

You were given a tour of our complete shop by Scott, my head employee, you knew we have two separated halves to our building. We left the office door to the body shop open, knowing you were coming. Had I known you were going to sneak off like a theif in the night, without contacting us when you arrived, I would have locked the door. All 3 of my mechanics were in the other half of my shop installing an engine. They heard you pull up and anticipated you would be in to see them. They were right in the middle of aligning the engine to the transmission and couldn't drop what they were doing immediately. The office door was locked to the mechanics side because I had to run for parts needed on the job they were doing, you merely had to go into the shop door fo find all 3 employees working! They anticipated you would be in to ask for help, after they had the engine and transmission mated together, Scott looked out the door to see you driving off!


Also, he states that Scott came outside to see me leave at 3:30. If you refer to the pictures I posted showing my car and the witness who was shown in the picture, the photo times show from 3:30(picture of car sitting by street) to 3:55 (three corvettes sitting out in front of his building). I did not leave until about 10 minutes later, about 4:05-4:10. I would like to see anyone arrive, walk inside the building, find others to help push the vehicle into trailer(The first gent and myself took 10-15 to unsuccessfully try to load it) and leave all in the short time frame he describes. Quite an exageration again. I will say that I was amazed when I read his rebuttal. Even the little details were fabricated,such as me calling at 6:00 a.m. to let him know I was leaving to bring up my car and drop it off. That never happened. I actually left at 4:00 a.m. and it did take us longer to arrive due to weather. I did call him once I arrived in the Denver area to let him know I would be there shortly. These details may seem trivial, but again, there are so many lies.


Furthermore, money was never the issue on my end when I dropped the car off, as I had already set aside $60,000 in my checking account to finish the project. When Gary gave me the initial verbal estimate, I stressed to him that I wanted to have all the cash ready before bringing it up, and at that time I only had $10k ready. He told me to go ahead and bring it up anyway, and asked if I would have the rest by the time it was done in 3 months. I told him I did not want to do that. The problem for me when I arrived was that he never communicated he needed the deposit, thus I did not bring it along when I dropped the car off. The car alone is worth a substantial amount as collateral as it is. Many forum members have said that they pay as the work is done in increments. In 13 years as an insurance agent, I have never had anyone have to go into a body shop and pay up-front for the work before it is done. Gary is painting quite a different picture of events than actually occured, and fitting in subtle insinuations to deflect from the truth.

As far as him contacting his friends in the Albuquerque Corvette Community and their supposed reaction toward me, that is laughable considering I don't belong to any Corvette groups and only know one person who is involved in them in the Albuquerque area, and is simply an acquaintence. Likewise, how in the world local shops would have anything to say about me is a surprise. The only local body man I have worked with is Otto @ Otto's Garage, who most local car people would know. He has been doing the body work on a '63 Impala resto-mod I am working on for my parents for several months, and is a great guy who does excellent work. I have also used Chad Dewees, head painter at Galles Chevrolet, for many past paint jobs, again excellent work. These are the only two locals I have used and we have never had any problems, and would welcome anyone to contact either of them to ask about their experience with me as a customer. I would also like to state that I did not "attack" his friends who logged into the forums on his behalf. They immediately started in with name-calling, stating I was a lier and other slurs. I simply responded.

Lastly, he states in his reply that I posted asking "anyone out there who had bad experiences with Corvette City?". The actual post was worded "Please let me know what experience you had with Corvette City(Denver Colo) " A little bit different. He also implies that the powder coating had problems, which is rediculous. There was absolutely no problem with the powder coating or preparation. He is trying to shift the attention and hint that the quality of work I have had done is substandard, when in fact, I have painstakingly taken the time to do a top-notch job, and paid great attention to detail.

I had absolutely no reason to lie about anything that happened. I took the car to him in good faith, because I wanted the work done by someone experienced in fiberglass and liked the extended fenders, and in the end, we did not deal well together. I did not post anything in order to be vindictive, but rather to let others know to be cautious, and do their research before using anyone. As I stated before, his workmanship was not the problem for me; it was reliability and honesty. This is more than evident to me now that I have read his smooth-talking lies- former police officer or not. Take the information I have given you or not. It's up to you.

Chuck