Heh..What Do You Think Of This Idea..Is it a Waste of Money??

[Viet Nam Vett]

Just cruzen around and I ended up here.............

http://www.csr-performance.com/water_pump2.html

What are the pro's and Con's of using an electric water pump for the street. I like the idea of cool down after shuting the motor off. Also creeping in traffic when it's 100* out side.

Check out the pump for the 502 BB # (900)

Soooooooooooooo...What do you think.....This money is burning a hole in my pocket......:L

 

[bossvette]

I may be wrong but I think they are used mainly by drag racers and may not flow enough for extended use on the street.

 

[67HEAVEN]

My dual electric fans blow after ignition shut-off to help to cool things down.

I hadn't considered an electric coolant pump.

 

[photovette]

Mechanical water pumps give you warning when they're about to go bad--I've always nursed a car home when it's happened. These electric pumps seem like they'd just go and you'd be stuck. Why make a 'vette less reliable?!

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

I may be wrong but I think they are used mainly by drag racers and may not flow enough for extended use on the street.

Thanks for the reply there Bossvette

According to the spec...they flow 37 Gallons Per Min...!!!!!!! That's some Boocoo Water...!!!

My dual electric fans blow after ignition shut-off to help to cool things down.

I hadn't considered an electric coolant pump.

Well since I'm throwing money at this project....This might be Cool....:L

Mechanical water pumps give you warning when they're about to go bad--I've always nursed a car home when it's happened. These electric pumps seem like they'd just go and you'd be stuck. Why make a 'vette less reliable?!

Good point...But by adding a warning lamp and a beeper alarm at least you know when it quits. .. Then It's "AAA".... :L

 

[67HEAVEN]

Well since I'm throwing money at this project....This might be Cool....:L

Mark,

If you've got too many Ben Franklins laying around your place, wallpaper the underhood with them.

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

Mark,

If you've got too many Ben Franklins laying around your place, wallpaper the underhood with them.

Yeah ..but the pump also comes in purple.....And other colors...
Maybe I'll buy 2 ..and hook them up in sereis....

 

[Sting Ray]

Mark,

At that rate would the coolant actually have enough time to be brought down in temp in that new rad ? Might be a question for Tom D.

Tom M

 

[WayneLBurnham]

Some of the new Mezziere's (or mebbe Milodon?) flow over 50....

Most say even this isn't enough compared to a belt driven high flow manual.

I would love to see similar flow numbers for the mechanicals, but have never seen any pump curves for them. This leaves me unable to decide for myself. I suppose I could call Milodon, Edlebrock, FlowKooler, etc. to get some hard data, but, there is that whole laziness thing, isn't there?

I've been watching these for a few years, hoping they clearly get to the point of surpassing the flow of mechanicals in time to use one on the real engine. I really like the idea of both less parasitic drag and being able to cool it after shutdown. Most I talked to said electric fans: good upgrade, electric pumps: not. Some cars I've seen listed do use the CSI and Mezziere and a few other pumps.

I saw several that really impressed me that were a booster to the mechanical. (There is also a setup that puts an electric drive on a mechanical, but that's not what I was looking at.) These go between the low side mechanical pump and the radiator. With one of these, while they mainly provided boosted flow during engine operation, you can still have water pumping after shutdown.

I saw these in a Custom Rod mag, like the Evans Waterless (350 deg plus normal operation) propylene glycol coolant. I keep meaning to try one, but never have. (That looks like a lot of fun plumbing that thing especially with my SS radiator hoses - at least I have no A/C to work around...:cry )

-------

You know, for $300 or so, this is a fairly cheap thing to test out. Water pumps are a fast change. Pick an evening in a weekend expecting to have relaltively hot days of the same temperature range....swap them out. Drive it silly the next day, compare temps to the day before doing a bunch of standard uses, including at least one hour long hard cruise. That's actually a fairly tempting day project for early this summer....don't double dawg dare me to!

....I can't imagine some car rag hasn't already done this fifteen times.

 

[bossvette]

One other consideration on a street car is the alternator and AC if equiped; can you still use your pulleys, is the legnth correct for a Vette?
As cool as they look if they were feasable for a street car I think the Street Rod guys would be all over them. Let us know if you do try it how it works out.

 

[henny496]

water pump

Hello
I had purchased a Moroso electric water pump for my vette intially. This motor is to be street driven and I was later told that an electric pump is insufficient for the street
The reason being As engine load and RPM increase , you need more pressure and flow inside the block and a steady flow electric pump cannot do this.
My drag car had a electric pump that you could shut off at the line and start it again at the end of the run and in the pits on cooldown. The pumps back then could not be run continuously anyway. The new ones are better
I am going to run a mechanical aluminum pump
take care
Tom

 

[Tyler Townsley]

My wifes new Beatle uses an electric water pump so OEMs are going to them too. Another thought is an electric PS pump. I saw a real nice one on some TVRs racing at Sebring. There is somebody building them on the East Coast for race cars anyone know who.

Tyler

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

Thanks Guys,

Some very interesting points there Wayne, I think your right on point. And Tom ...you also have a good point as well as every one else who replied. Now if SWC Duke and or John Z would add there engineering comments or some one else could explain the tech side ..this might also shed some more light on the subject.

But...as we all know ...sometimes old school is still the best. But it would be interesting to try this idea. I don't think anyone has equiped there Vette with an electric pump for the street. If you have ...chime right in..

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

Just received an email from my friend Bill B. Bill knows a thing or two about engineering... (For Real)..


Here's what he sent.... I think this puts it to bed..

According to the AMA specs published by Chevrolet, the 427 water pump puts out 82 GPM at 5200 rpm. The 327 water pump puts out 57 GPM at 4400 rpm.

The volume a centrifugal pump puts out is proportional to the pump speed.

V1 (n2 / n1) = V2 Where V1 is the volume at rpm n1 and V2 is the volume at rpm n2. In other words double the speed double the volume.

If the electric pump puts out 37 GPM then rearranging the equaton and solving for n2 we see that the stock 427 pump puts out 37 GPM at about 2350 rpm. Using the electric pump you would run out of flow at 2350 rpm and it would overheat after that.

Thanks Bill

 

[JohnZ]

<<According to the AMA specs published by Chevrolet, the 427 water pump puts out 82 GPM at 5200 rpm. The 327 water pump puts out 57 GPM at 4400 rpm.

The volume a centrifugal pump puts out is proportional to the pump speed.

V1 (n2 / n1) = V2 Where V1 is the volume at rpm n1 and V2 is the volume at rpm n2. In other words double the speed double the volume.

If the electric pump puts out 37 GPM then rearranging the equaton and solving for n2 we see that the stock 427 pump puts out 37 GPM at about 2350 rpm. Using the electric pump you would run out of flow at 2350 rpm and it would overheat after that.>>

I agree - the electric pumps are great for drag cars, but they're not optimized for the wide spectrum of conditions encountered in normal street operation; I think most guys buy them because they "look cool in the magazines on the Pro-Streeters" :eyerole . They also place another full-time parasitic load on the electrical system that wasn't there before, and their reliability is suspect in full-time operation. The factory pumps have been developed and optimized over many years to keep coolant moving at the correct rates at varying rpm's without cavitation, and work very well with excellent reliability. What do you do on Sunday 40 miles west of Bingo Flats, Nebraska, when your big-buck ultra-anodized whizbang Meziere electric water pump takes a dump and no auto parts store sells them?

One of the new 2006 BMW's uses a computer-controlled electric water pump (for packaging reasons), and it only costs $2,200.00 (in the box).

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

What do you do on Sunday 40 miles west of Bingo Flats, Nebraska, when your big-buck ultra-anodized whizbang Meziere electric water pump takes a dump and no auto parts store sells them?

One of the new 2006 BMW's uses a computer-controlled electric water pump (for packaging reasons), and it only costs $2,200.00 (in the box).

Or in my case Bum Fu_k Egypt.......

Yeah...I'm sticken with The General's wiz bang mechanical cast iron crank em up
pump. Thanks John.. enjoyed the Bingo Flats thing..

 

[67HEAVEN]

Yeah...I'm sticken with The General's wiz bang mechanical cast iron crank em up
pump.

Nay, nay, nay. You got an aluminum pump with that 502.

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

Nay, nay, nay. You got an aluminum pump with that 502.

Ahhhhhhhhhhh.....Ok...Aluminum........Geeeeeeeeeeeeezzz....... Just like my first wife:ugh

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

Some more techy facts from Bill... Interesting....

The Chevrolet specs published in the AMA documents were based on the original design cast iron water pump impeller. In the photos attached you can see the back of this impeller design is closed which precludes bypass of the fluid around the impeller vanes.

Most re-built pumps use a stamped steel impeller rather than the cast iron type original to these pumps. As such, the rated flow will not be obtained due to the open design of the stamped impeller.

Chapter 6K of the Chassis Overhaul Manual (1966 version) requires a measurement between the pump body and the pump impeller vanes of 0.010 to 0.035 inches and the impeller back surface to be 0.000 to 0.018 inches below the back cover gasket surface. These dimensions are using the cast iron impeller and cannot be obtained with the stamped steel impeller.

On my stock 66 327-300 using a C/B radiator (my original went south before the DeWitt's, now installed, were available) I could see a 10 degree difference in highway speed temperature between the cast iron and stamped impeller pumps.

Bill See Pic's Below

 

[67HEAVEN]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh.....Ok...Aluminum........Geeeeeeeeeeeeezzz....... Just like my first wife:ugh

Was she right too?