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How many 67 427's are real?

Jim Hester

Active member
Joined
Dec 7, 2004
Messages
37
Location
Kingwood, Tx
Corvette
67 Lynndale Coupe, '09 Cyber Gr ZR1
I have long wondered why there appears to be a disproportionate number of 1967 427’s for sale compared to 1967 327’s for sale at any one time. I recently scanned the sales adds on the internet, classic Corvette dealers, publications etc.. Out of 121 ‘67’s for sale, 62 were 427’s while 59 were 327’s. In 1967 42% of all vettes were 427’s while 58% were 327’s. At first I attributed this to the fact that 427’s are much more valuable/collectible and therefore were more likely to be for sale. While this may be partially true, I do not think it totally accounts for the disparity. To wit, in 1967 63% of all vettes were convertibles and have since shown to be more collectible. The same population of 121 vettes mentioned above included 80 convertibles or 66% of the total – which is very close to the 63% produced. All this tells me that collectibilty is not a major factor in assessing the relative availability of either body style and therefore should extend to motors as well. Now let’s go back to the 427 issue. Certainly the reason there are more 427’s as a percentage of available ‘67’s than historic production percentages would suggest is value, but not because of some anomaly or collectibility reason. My theory is that counterfeit 427’s make-up a significant portion of ‘67 vettes on the market because they can bring big bucks – enough to pay for the alterations. Comments?
 
So sad but true!!!!!!!!!

Yes that is a problem even at the Barrett Jackson Auctions, that's why you must document it before they put it up for sale. If a person buys a car that was not what was stated, they (BJ) forfeit their commissions and then it becomes a legal situation with the owner of record before you. But first you have to prove that is was intentional.

It is not difficult to alter if you know what you are doing and knowing what to alter. Forget Car-fax, you must do your reaserch from the vin# before you buy.
Yes there are ways that it can be altered also.

Always buy from a legitimate source that you can go back to.

Alan
 
I have heard it said that of the 9000 or so 67 BB vettes originally produced, only 15000 still exist!

John
Milwaukee

kingman said:
Yes that is a problem even at the Barrett Jackson Auctions, that's why you must document it before they put it up for sale. If a person buys a car that was not what was stated, they (BJ) forfeit their commissions and then it becomes a legal situation with the owner of record before you. But first you have to prove that is was intentional.

It is not difficult to alter if you know what you are doing and knowing what to alter. Forget Car-fax, you must do your reaserch from the vin# before you buy.
Yes there are ways that it can be altered also.

Always buy from a legitimate source that you can go back to.

Alan
 
My question is:

Do the numerous fake BB's on the market and in garages have a positive or negative impact on the market value of my two SB 67's? Thoughts?
 
Imitation is the best form of flattery. The fact that there is so many false 427's shows the desirabilty of a real one.

What hurts the market value of your SB's, is the C2 kit cars.
 
Tempus_Fugit said:
I have heard it said that of the 9000 or so 67 BB vettes originally produced, only 15000 still exist!

John
Milwaukee


;LOL
 
Jim Hester said:
My question is:

Do the numerous fake BB's on the market and in garages have a positive or negative impact on the market value of my two SB 67's? Thoughts?

In my own special case, it matters not. I simply mean it matters not to me because:

a) I don't own a small block
b) My car was a real L-71 (now ZZ-502)
c) I'm never selling anyway.....no really, I'm never selling. After 38 years, do you think I'd sell it now? :D After I die, my son will drive it into the ground....then he'll sell.

However, I recognize that people do buy and sell these cars, so my answer is that the conversion of so many formerly small-block cars to big-block status can only help you.

Why? Because, as small-block cars become fewer and fewer to come by, their relative value should increase. And, it's certainly easier to believe their lineage, is it not? Besides, as the price of fuel continues to skyrocket, your resale market will be much broader if you can include "driver customers" who want small-block gas mileage in with "garage queen customers" who don't care about mileage, no?

:w
 
If you own a C-2 or C-1, then who cares about mileage? Pesonally I do not think there are that many more big blocks today than there were in 67. Why, you may ask? Because by 69 most original 427 67 HP engines had blown out # 6 or # 1 cylinders due to the failure of the early rod bolts and valve springs. In other words at leat a 50% to 75 % failure rate! That went for Chevelles & Camaros, too. So, when one let go, you just put in whatever you could get your hands on. Who cared about numbers? There weren't that many 351 blocks made for service, so IMHO, most of the real 67 HP cars are restamps anyway.
 
67HEAVEN said:
However, I recognize that people do buy and sell these cars, so my answer is that the conversion of so many formerly small-block cars to big-block status can only help you.

Why? Because, as small-block cars become fewer and fewer to come by, their relative value should increase. And, it's certainly easier to believe their lineage, is it not? Besides, as the price of fuel continues to skyrocket, your resale market will be much broader if you can include "driver customers" who want small-block gas mileage in with "garage queen customers" who don't care about mileage, no?

:w

I agree, much for the same reasons quoted above. And I don't believe the kit cars are detrimental at all to the price and value of small blocks. Whole different market, an original car will always be an original car, and an imitation will always be an imitation. My thoughts!!!

:beer
 
Not sure where mileage became an issue, but I'm not sure I can agree that early engine failures has necessarily resulted in a fewer 427's today. "Fake" 427's undoubtedly make up a significant portion of the market. Question is: Is it 5% or 50%?
 
Jim Hester said:
Not sure where mileage became an issue,

To "some" potential buyers....those buying these cars for driving (not polishing), the mileage difference between a 300hp small block and a 435hp big block will increasingly make a real difference in affordability and therefore desirability.
 
Since roughly $5k can freshen a motor, I don't think mileage plays a big factor in the overall market.
 
Jim Hester said:
Since roughly $5k can freshen a motor, I don't think mileage plays a big factor in the overall market.

Mileage on these cars is whatever you want it to be. Changeing the odo is just too easy. I think once the word gets around just how much was forged on the 802 (OLD eyes)car the value of the 427 cars will drop to %10/15 priemum over the 327 cars. If you have one and want the big money better act now. Bloomington will be the real first test of this.

Tyler
 
67HEAVEN said:
"Gas" mileage......small block driver vs big block driver. :)

Got it!

Any word on whether BJ has been informed of the 802 fraud?
 
Jim Hester said:
Got it!

Any word on whether BJ has been informed of the 802 fraud?

I clipped this from another forum:


I sent an email to B-J about this car, I thought you might like to see it along with their response...
Quote:
Have you been made aware of this claim about your lot number 450.1 at your last auction? Please follow this link and read - http://www.docrebuild.com/dr-r-web/currentevents-56a.html

If this is true at the very least you should publicize who "restored" this car from a yellow small block into a black big block car...

Thanks for your attention, your reply is appreciated.
Name Edited Out

Quote:
These are not our cars, and we do not represent them. They are represented by the owner. We provide the venue that brings buyers and sellers together. Thanx—John
John Cook, Barrett-Jackson Consignment Liaison

Caveat emptor, indeed!
 

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