question on dash warning light

[BarryK]

the warning light in the middle of the instrument cluster that warns that the headlight buckets are closed but the lights are still on is not working since I got my car back from the paint shop.
I actually noticed this when I went to pick up the car and asked him about it. He hadn't noticed the problem but was positice that he rehooked up every single wire. He than went and looked at the wiring harness and found nothing disconnected or loose.
Could it be something inside the headlight buckets that came unconnected? I don't know if the light is controlled by the microswitch that stops the buckets but he is very sure the switches are working fine.
The warning light did work previously. It's not really a big deal, but it would be nice to have it working again like it's supposed to be. I'm not sure if it makes a difference or not, but the other warning light that lights up on hi-beams IS working properly.

any suggestions?

 

[Ron Miller]

Nothing inside the buckets related to the warning light. The microswitches are normally closed and allow power to the warning light. Only when the buckets are fully closed with the headlamps on and both microswitches are pressed in (which opens the circuit) is the instrument panel light supposed to go out. So, the bulb may be shot, or not getting power. I'd get a wiring diagram and begin there!

Ron

 

[Subfixer]

There is a microswitch on each bucket mechanism that supply a ground to the light when the buckets are in any position but full open. The switches are wire in parallel, which means each switch provides a ground. Those wires are hard to see with the hood on and the grill installed. You can see them with a mirror. Either both switches aren't wired up, or your bulb burned out. 12V gets to the warning light via the headlight switch. I'm betting on the bulb.

 

[BarryK]

thanks Ron. I'm glad to know the headlight buckets don't have to come back at at least!
if it turns out to be the bulb and I'll need to remove the entire cluster to get at it than it will wait until winter

 

[BarryK]

thanks again once more today Paul!
i'll try to get a mirror in there to look at the switches and make sure they are definately wired. If they are and it's the bulb than it will wait till winter for me to attemp to remove the cluster. I'm not taking any chances on screwing things up between now and the rest of the time I have driving the car this season. Over the winter I can take my time, go slow, and hopefully not f**K things up too much. If I have to remove the cluster I'll probably change out all the bulbs behind there so I won't have to do that again for a while.

 

[Jeff Farrar]

If it worked before I doubt the light would have gone bad. Mine lights up if you have the ebrake engaged at all. So you could check the light that way. Better guess it that one of the ends of the microswitches is not hooked up. Get a flashlight and a mirror and look right next to the bucket. Should be easy to see.

 

[BarryK]

Thanks Jeff!
well, it would be nice if it WASN'T the bulb simply so I don't have to remove the instrument cluster.

As soon as my car gets back home again I'll check it out.

 

[67HEAVEN]

Barry,

If a bulb, you should be able to reach it (with your good arm ) by laying under the dash.

 

[BarryK]

oh? I thought to get to the bulbs the cluster had to come out. Thanks for correcting me on that Bob - GREATLY appreciated.

BTW, BOTH arms are good again now

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

oh? I thought to get to the bulbs the cluster had to come out. Thanks for correcting me on that Bob - GREATLY appreciated.

BTW, BOTH arms are good again now

Well after you try and get those Big Fat Meat Hooks up under their...you might end up dislocating your shoulder.....:L

If you want to make it easy.....take out the 2 bolts that hold the seat track down ..lift the seat out and that will give you room to lay down and get a hold of that sucker.....

 

[BarryK]

Mark
after I check out the switches under the hood I'll determine if i need to climb under the dash. I already found out it's MUCH easier to get under there with the seat out. Luckily the seats were still out when I put the new rear blower cable in under the dash 2 weeks ago which was a ton easier than the first time I pulled it out with the seats still in the car.
Hell, maybe I'll make it REAL easy on myself and just drive the car down to you and have you get inside the dash for me............. afterall, you are the wiring expert now

 

[stepinwolf]

Something else to think about

BarryK,

If the harness was not molested during the restoration, than we will take it for granted that the correct flashing bulb is in place, and that the socket is in the correct opening. This being said, this is a two wire socket, and the bulb holder that goes into the rear of the cluster is soft plastic. It is quite possible, that depending in the way the main harness was secured to the underdash area, that the socket could simply have been pulled out of the rear cluster cover. If that was the case, then all that would be needed would be for you to re-insert the socket in it's place.

It's a tight fit up there and if the main harness is not in the exact position, it does put a strain on the wires going through the flasher bulb.

IMPORTANT. disconnect the battery, and remove watch, rings, etc. before sticking your hand up there.

One last little tidbit that will be very helpful in the case, and other circumstances also, is to keep your eyes completely closed when trying to re-insert any wires, sockets, etc, that you are not visable to the eye, or that you cannot see. Please don't laugh, because I an not doing any dick pulling here, it's the honest to God, truth.

When working in any confined area, that is not visible, keeping your eyes closed will make the task easier to accomplish. In doing so, your concentration and hand skills will increase more then twice fold. I have no logical explanation for this quirk, but time and time again , not only has it worked for me, but for a lot of friends to whom I have made this same recommendation. IN a nutshell, if you can't see it, close your eyes and feel your way around.

Try it , I promise you it does work.


Stepinwolf

 

[BarryK]

Hi Step.
I really appreciate the info.
The warning light worked fine before the paint job and nothing under the dash was touched except for when I removed than reinstalled a new control cable for the rear blower. I don't recall coming near any other wires while under the dash but anything is possible. I'll look to see if either of the two wires to the light socket may have gotten jarred loose. I'm inclined to think the issue is most likely one of the switches at the buckets though as the buckets were completely removed during the paint job so I think there is a great possibility of something not be 100% in that area since it was an area being worked on rather than under the dash but who knows, anything is possible.

I understand completely what you mean about working with closed eyes in areas that are difficult or impossible to see while working in them. I've found myself doing this many times while working on other things. A lot of times I can see something only before I can reach it with my hands but once my hands are at the object my sight is blocked so i'll study what needs to be done than put my hand(s) in to do the work with my eyes shut and concentrate on how I saw it must be done. You are correct in saying that it does help a lot of times. I guess the brain isn't fighting TRYING to see something it can't so with your eyes closed it's not distracted and it's easier to concentrate on making your fingers feel around for what you know is there and how things must go together and you can do it by feel.

 

[Viet Nam Vett]

To make it easier....(I didn't read to see if any posted this so...forgive the dupe)

Get your self some 4 inch long bolts the same as the dash hold in screws... Screw them in on at a time and then remove the lower column suport and slide that sucker out on the long screws ...this will give you some extra room for those meat hooks of yours....Ka..Bish...??

 

[JohnZ]

I'd bet on one of the wires not being connected at the microswitches (each switch has two connections), or one of the Y-stop bolts isn't contacting the button on one of the switches; the switches are wired in parallel, and it only takes one non-functional switch to make the circuit inoperative. In the photo below, the microswitch connectors are the light blue ones at the extreme right and left of the photo (you're looking at it through the radiator opening).

 

[BarryK]

Mark
I know I replied to you last night but just realized it's not here :confused
oh well

IF i need to pull the cluster it won't be until winter so i'll save that tip - sounds very useful and won't need to worry about the whole cluster just hanging by the wires and cables. THANKS!

 

[BarryK]

awesome John! Leave it to you to come up with the perfect picture to let me see just what I'll be looking for. That's VERY handy as I really wasn't sure where the switches were located under there so this will save me a lot of time looking.

 

[stepinwolf]

One more thing that comes to mind

awesome John! Leave it to you to come up with the perfect picture to let me see just what I'll be looking for. That's VERY handy as I really wasn't sure where the switches were located under there so this will save me a lot of time looking.

If after checking on the correct installation of the two connectors, there is one other thing that you might have a closer look at.

While looking at JohnZ's picture of the headlight motors, showing the switches, there is one more little anomaly that comes to mind. It's the sloppiness that is seen with the installation of these switches in the inner headlamp pivot support housing. When you insert the neck of the switch ( for the lack of a better word ) into the housing, and then use the two 1" screws to tighten the switch, there will be a problem if the screws are turn down too tight. The reason is because if the space ( approx 1/8" ) between the side of the plastic switch, and the aluminium housing. If you do not pay attention to this during the installation, and tighten down the screws a little too tight, it will pry the switch towards the housing, and definitely crack the plastic housing of the switch, and risk it's malfunction.

In most of my installations, I have been forced to carefully insert a couple of small thin flat between the switch, and the housing to fill the excess space, thereby getting a solid foundation on which to tighten down the switch.

BTY, you need not purchase these small switches from the Corvette suppliers, because most of the electronic stores have the same switch for only a few dollars, ( and some others of a much better quality ). The only difference is in the number of tangs ( three instead of two ) exiting the replacement switches. The additional tang needs only to be bent over a few times, and it then brakes off.


Stepinwolf

 

[BarryK]

great info Step.
when I look for the switches and see if they are connected correctly and if i find they are I'll than look to see if they look to be tightened down too much. I'd imagine if they are it would be possible to see the switch housing to be somewhat warped or strained or as you say possibly even cracked.

Question: IF that's the case and my painter overtightened them when he reassembled the buckets and reinstalled them does that mean the entire bucket(s) have to come off to replace the switch(s)??

unnfortunately, I have to wait another day or two to get my car back from the mechanic before I can start looking at my car regarding this problem

 

[Subfixer]

Barry, you can get the switches out witout removing anything. However, you'll need a mirror to do it. Gets a little confusing when everything is backwards in the mirror, but it can be done. It's MUCH easier with the hood removed.