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RTV removal, new oil pump and....

djsroknrol

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 12, 2010
Messages
247
Location
Lake Havasu City, Arizona
Corvette
1984 L83/MD8 red coupe
I think 12 means communication with the ECM from the ALDL interface - normal (did it flash 3 times?).

I wouldn't trust any 'readings' too much until the rebuild... Any progress there?

It flashed 3X code 12 and then just flashed code 12 after that.

As far as the engine rebuild goes, it's in litigation now...got a high profile lawyer on the case now. My son and I dropped the pan, pulled a HANDFUL of RTV from the pickup tube and screen, installed as new oil pump, ran an engine flush with a new filter and refilled it with a second filter....she's got 30lbs@1500RPM and 10lbs at idle. I figured it was good enough to drive while I'm waiting on the outcome and the best thing is...I still don't hear a knock (fingers crossed) :D
 
30 whole psi, huh? Not bad...

Maybe drain it, and fill with 50/50

75-140-gear-oil-790743.jpg

1230924829_molasses_1.jpg
 
LOL...it's not that bad yet. Those pressure readings are running 40 weight..

Thats fair for 40 wt....I have to believe that 5-30 would not do well at idle. With 10 lbs @ idle with 40wt I'd say the main beaings were well worn. The clogged oil pump pick-up screen could have caused oil starvation that led to the bearings grinding themselves to pieces.

It sounds to me like the RTV was the culprit, not necessarily the grinding pad, although that did'nt help. The collection of trash that went into the pan is what caused the damage.

I wonder how many other vehicles that wanna be mechanic destroyed during his time at that shop and if anyone else had come forward? That would be interesting...if there was a history at that shop or with that incredibly stupid mechanic.
 
I pulled out a compete square of RTV in the shape of an intake port...sigh...got more pics and I'll post them soon.

The analysis of the oil came back and saw no trace of abrasive material in the sample, so I agree with your assessment of it boomdriver; a case of oil starvation.

I noticed a leak by the distributor seal, so I put it back in the garage for a couple of days to address the leak. I also noticed that since I changed the oil pressure sender, my cold start pressure went from 80 to 40 lbs and after the oil warms up it only sits at 8 - 9 lbs from the 10 - 12 lbs I had at idle. A friend at the local auto parts store said that there might be a plug in the oil bypass to the filter...I can't see where that would be an issue, but I'd like to investigate it further.

There were a couple of ground connections that I want to go over and a mysterious weather pak connection that needs a home...lol
 
If the 1984 oil pressure sending unit is anything like that on my 1989, don't expect pinpoint accuracy. I ended up testing 3 different units to find one that was somewhat accurate. NAPA aftermarket was the best and was made in the USA. ACDelco and Autozone were poor replacements.
 
If the 1984 oil pressure sending unit is anything like that on my 1989, don't expect pinpoint accuracy. I ended up testing 3 different units to find one that was somewhat accurate. NAPA aftermarket was the best and was made in the USA. ACDelco and Autozone were poor replacements.

I'm STILL having issues with my pressure sender. AFter many many test and lots of digging, I am convinced there is a flaw in the harness. Someplace there is poor contact in a harness splice that allows the delicate resistance to vary, or not be measured at all. The new sender does exactly what the old one did. wiggling wires makes changes but the poor access to that section of harness makes it very difficult to explore furter. As long as it shows a varying pressure, thats all I can count on for now. These are NOT very accurate. More for display than anything.


At 8 PSi with 40wt running warm at idle, is not horrible,. but it is a sign that its soon going to be time for a crank rebuild. Thats really not as big of a deal as it sounds. Bearings are cheap and cranks get turned everyday, if necessary. Worst part is having to d/c all the rods to drop the crank. Its an "inframe" job thats not all that difficult.
When hot and under pressure the oil seeks the easiest way out, the path of least resistance. The first opportunity is thru the main bearings. Next is the filter housing itself. The bypass is a simple little metal spring that actually stays open much of the time allowing a percentage of the oil to go around filtration. That could have trash in it, could just be weak and staying open more than it should. Either the filter housing or bearings, the loss of pressure happens down there which reduces not only the pressure to the top end but also the volume. It's does'nt take a great deal of oil to lube the top end but it needs to be steady to lube and to carry heat away from the working parts.

Until an engine gets so loose that it makes noise, increasing the vol of oil is the same as decreasing the loss in the bearings. If the flow is more than can be leaked, then you get the required oil to the top end. People have been installing hi-vol pumps in worn motors for many yrs in an effort to delay the inevitable and it does work to some degree. But, as normal wear continues it will reach the point of being too loose, and things will begin to make noise as the oil can no longer fill the gap between the surfaces. Thicker oil works well at normal temps, but for cold starts its a double edged sword. Its very bad for start up and difficult to circulate when cold. Thats where an additive like Dura-Lube or ProLong will possibly help. I have always used ProLong and have seen the results. It does help with dry starts or cold start.

Might want to try that and even look at Valvoline racing oils in the 40 or 50 wt IF it gets worse. 20-50 might work with 50wt to top it off when it runs low.
I sure hope the legal process will lead to a rebuild. These car warranty companies love to tell you there should'nt be a worn out engine IF you do the maintinence, so the same logic should apply here. The age of the car is what your lawyer has to argue against. In the meantime, just keep the oil thick and the stress down and hope for the best.
 
I'm STILL having issues with my pressure sender.

Thats where an additive like Dura-Lube or ProLong will possibly help. I have always used ProLong and have seen the results. It does help with dry starts or cold start.

Hook up a mechanical gauge at the point where the oil pressure sender goes to and see what readings you get.

How did you verify that the snake oils help?
 
Thread split at request of originator.

-Mac
 
Hook up a mechanical gauge at the point where the oil pressure sender goes to and see what readings you get.

How did you verify that the snake oils help?

Had 130,000+ on the blown motor. during the autopsy the machine shop took note that the bearings were new condition, and all the other wear parts were is great shape. Shop thought it was a 30,000...not the 130K that it was.

I use the stuff every oil change and it helps stop dry start wear while the motor pumps oil to the top end. ProLong seems to be the reason why things are wearing less than they should. add a dose each oil change and its good to go.
 
Had 130,000+ on the blown motor. during the autopsy the machine shop took note that the bearings were new condition, and all the other wear parts were is great shape. Shop thought it was a 30,000...not the 130K that it was.

I use the stuff every oil change and it helps stop dry start wear while the motor pumps oil to the top end. ProLong seems to be the reason why things are wearing less than they should. add a dose each oil change and its good to go.

I believe that comes under the heading of anecdotal evidence. I believe in scientific evidence myself. Anecdotal evidence is used by the peddlers of the snake oil because it gives "proof" that is cheaply done and people believe it because it is simple to understand. Whether it is correct is another story.

It probably doesn't do any harm but whether it does good or not can only be verified by the scientific process. When a company peddles a product and refuses to show scientific results done by an accredited laboratory using standard testing methods, I tend to be very skeptical about the "proof" they provide. A true way to tell would be to run a bunch of similarly built motors, some with and some without and measure the results. Double blind test is pretty much the gold standard.
 
..trash that went into the pan is what caused the damage...

I never thought of it this way until now... but the damage caused by trash like gaskets and sealants in the oil must be the automotive equivalent of throwing a clot.

:ugh
 

That's Enzyte but same thing as all the motor oil additives. All talk, no proof. But at least, somebody buys them, swears by them WITHOUT scientific proof which keeps sales up and the economy going or they would too need a bailout.
 
I pulled out a compete square of RTV in the shape of an intake port...sigh...got more pics and I'll post them soon.

This will be interesting to see; got a pic yet?

Does Crossfire intake NOT use gaskets for intake-to-cylinder head junction? If it does not, you STILL cannot use RTV, because gasoline (or vapors) SOLVES RTV, sort of - it swells it, and makes it almost off, even if it was bonded to a clean surface.
 
Hopefully pictures tonight when I get home....I have to get them sent from my son's iPhone. :CRASH

We're looking at the filter end of things for more trash and finishing the EGR and THERMAC stuff I noticed; it might smooth things out ;)
 
Hopefully pictures tonight when I get home....I have to get them sent from my son's iPhone. :CRASH

We're looking at the filter end of things for more trash and finishing the EGR and THERMAC stuff I noticed; it might smooth things out ;)

Running some engine flush might help pospone the inevitable rebuild.

I had to flush mine once do to the crank case being full of gasoline...3 oil changes in 2 days (cheap oil) to get all the contaminates out.
 
Here's what we pulled out of the screen and pickup tube....
 

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Looks like yankee tap water - Chunky - Style.

I don't think I'd buy new parts to go in such a motor - I'd have to iPhone the shop hack that worked on it, send pics, and tell him to send a check.

Either that, or I take the lid off a can...















whupass.jpg
 
I'm amazed (and so is everyone else for that matter) that I've kept my cool about it...but I have to remember that I didn't deal with the shop, my son did and the car was a gift.

If I were to get into it with them at this juncture, it would be a waste of talk time ;)

UPDATE: lower oil pressure, tried motor honey, no difference...maybe too thick? Revs still increase pressure and I'm thinking there's more junk somewhere else....oil bypass working and clear.
 

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