What should I do?

[1BA93Vette]

Hello all
I was planing to put straight pipes on my 93'. I was going to buy long tube headers and completly put duals going to the back, no muffs and no cats, just dual pipes. What kind of problems will I run into in doing this? any experiences?thanks.
Josh
_______________________________________________________________
"Whoever said money cant buy happiness, obviously never bought a Corvette"

 

[Eagle85C4]

Well the big thing is that it is a felony to alter the stock exhaust by removing the cat-converter...per the Clean Air Act...

 

[Daryllawman]

:eek :nono

 

[JT ZR-Won]

Depending on how large of stright pipe you run, noise might be an issue. I'm tossing this idea around right now. I would go with some sort of X-pipe in the middle though for smoother flow.

Jay

 

[oldace84]

Think about the smog test's..............
Just a thought....
tony

 

[vader86]

Only possible problems with removing cats is the Oxygen sensor may read the temp of the exhaust as being too low, causing it to throw off the A/F mixture. Its not something you should really worry about, because this would probably set a code if it did happen, and it doesnt always happen. You would need a heated O2 sensor to fix it if it did. Just dont worry about it til it happens.

Otherwise, your only problem would be resonance, try to extend the duals past the rear bumper just a little with some chrome tips or something, that will decrease the resonance. An H or X pipe crossover might also help with that.

 

[78SilvAnniv]

Not, of course...

Well the big thing is that it is a felony to alter the stock exhaust by removing the cat-converter...per the Clean Air Act...

...that this has stopped anybody from altering their emissions and/or exhaust...


I'd check and see if there is smog testing in your area.
Perhaps keep whatever you remove in case the vehicle relocates to a different state that requires emissions testing.
I'd also still try to keep the vehicle running as cleanly as possible.
Heidi

 

[Edmond]

Won't he also run into the problem of having almost no back pressure and blowing the motor?

 

[78SilvAnniv]

Well...

Won't he also run into the problem of having almost no back pressure and blowing the motor?

I've seen instances where many owners have installed straight pipes and the engine has not had any problems. My own has a chambered exhaust, which looks very unrestrictive to me. My own theory is that with the bends in the pipes for the exhaust gases to travel around, there will be enough resistance for the engine's safety in regards to back pressure.

Perhaps someone who has qualified information about this will chime in, because I'd be interested in knowing the truth of the matter of backpressure and engine survival.

Now, if you drive a car with headers and nothing else for several months...that could create a serious problem for the engine!
Yeah, I speak from experience...
Heidi

 

[vette-dude]

Well the big thing is that it is a felony to alter the stock exhaust by removing the cat-converter...per the Clean Air Act...

When was the last time you saw anyone actually arrested and convicted for putting a modified exhaust sytem on a car?? Are there actually EPA cops that cruise around in unmarked black 4 x 4's that stop people and arrest them for illegal exhaust systems? I sure don't see any COP or Lawyer shows on TV that read "Ripped From the Headlines--Serial Automotive Exhaust Modifier Arrested, Terror Alert Level Lowered!!" Just putting you on but it does seem a little ridiculous that everytime someone mentions modifying an exhaust system someone else has to point out that it is a Felony to do so. I agree it is but I have never heard or read about anyone convicted of this "CRIME"! Just my $.02.

As for whether the straight pipe will work? I would go with the chambered exhaust system for all the same reasons the others have already given.

Randy

 

[Edmond]

When was the last time you saw anyone actually arrested and convicted for putting a modified exhaust sytem on a car?? Are there actually EPA cops that cruise around in unmarked black 4 x 4's that stop people and arrest them for illegal exhaust systems? I sure don't see any COP or Lawyer shows on TV that read "Ripped From the Headlines--Serial Automotive Exhaust Modifier Arrested, Terror Alert Level Lowered!!" Just putting you on but it does seem a little ridiculous that everytime someone mentions modifying an exhaust system someone else has to point out that it is a Felony to do so. I agree it is but I have never heard or read about anyone convicted of this "CRIME"! Just my $.02.

As for whether the straight pipe will work? I would go with the chambered exhaust system for all the same reasons the others have already given.

Randy

Randy,

It's not that a cop will go out there looking for that only violation. It's if you get pulled over for something else and they notice the EPA violation. You probably won't get arrested and all that, but I'm sure the fines are extremely hefty.

We point out that it's illegal because we're a community here. We have to watch out and protect each other, letting others know of laws is a part of that. He wasn't trying to mess with you, he's just letting you know.

 

[vette-dude]

Edmund,

Well that makes sense and thank you. I was just wondering why and now I know. You all have a good weekend, it's finally sunny here and the top is down on the Vette. We be cruisin'!

Randy

 

[Eagle85C4]

I used to live in Va. and know it to be an inspection state, if you go to get car inspected and the mechanic finds the system tampered with he cannot give you sticker and in most cases will call the state police and turn you in. When you weigh the difference in running without a converter and the 25K fine...well I just put new ones on my car. I would rather be safe and compliant with the law then the few measly horses you might get from running with out it and also being kinder to the enviorment.

Per the clean air act with respect to catalytic converters...


SEC. 205. CIVIL PENALTIES.
(a) Violations.- Any person who violates sections 203(a)(1),
203(a)(4), or 203(a)(5) or any manufacturer or dealer who
violates section 203(a)(3)(A) shall be subject to a civil penalty
of not more than $25,000. Any person otherthan a manufacturer or
dealer who violates section 203(a)(3)(A) or any person who
violates section 203(a)(3)(B) shall be subject to a civil penalty
of not more than $2,500. Any such violation with respect to
paragraph (1),(3)(A), or (4) of section 203(a) shall constitute a
separate offense with respect to each motor vehicle or motor
vehicle engine. Any such violation with respect to section
203(a)(3)(B) shall constitute a separate offense with respect to
each part or component. Any person who violates section 203(a)(2)
shall be subject to a civil penalty of not more than $25,000 per
day of violation.

 

[vette-dude]

Ok, these are Civil penalties and not a felony then. Correct? I didn't see the word Felony anywhere in the cited act. Did I miss it? Sorry for the Hijack. Just wanted to know.

Randy

 

[fast.asleep]

...being kinder to the environment.

I agree,
I'm not a "tree hugger" by any means, I just don't want my future Grandchildren to have to put on environmental suits every time they go outside.

 

[Vettelt193]

it is a $25k for the shop that does the work, not the individual. if you are caught, the worst case is you get a $2500 fine. it is usually a fix-it ticket though, and really not an issue.

1993 is the last year where it is completely easy to do. all you have to do is take them off, there is no ill effects to the car. the car will have a cooler interior, run better and sound better.
I would keep the original exhaust system though, and the really smart thing to do is make a 'test pipe' that bolts in in place of the cat. this way you can put the cat back any time you want. since your car has two of them, installing the cats would take about 20 minutes if they are bolt on... setting them up like that is a good fall back... especially for future sales, or the very small chance of having trouble with the law

 

[RubyDropTop]

Chambered Exhaust....This May Be for You

Well, I too have a chambered exhaust system on my car and I absolutely love it. There is nothing to fear in regard to the Clean Air Act, as this system is from the cats back.

There is no resonator, nor are there any mufflers - only chambers where those things would normally be. The idle is throaty and under throttle it is an aggressive sounding system. At cruise it mellows out, but you certainly know that the exshaust is not stock.

This may be the way for you to go as well, depending on what you are after. And just a heads up - I have heard first hand an L98 with straight pipes, and the sound was just loud. It lacked tone and refinement, it was just loud noise. The chambered system tones the exhaust and it sounds great.

Just thought I'd throw that out there for you to think about. The chambered systems can be purchased in both aluminized and stainless. Cost is $550.00 and $850.00 respectively.

 

[GS Diva]

Josh,

Why not just install muffler eliminators that have nothing to do with the cats? I had them in my '88 and loved the sound but I had no trouble passing the emission inspections.

Elaine

 

[Eagle85C4]

http://www.epa.gov/oar/caa/contents.html


The Clean Air Act is Federal Law and the responsibility of the EPA.....it is a felony to remove or otherwise tamper with the stock exhaust system. Some folks need to read the fine print. You can be fined up to 25K a day wether you are commercial shop owner or individual. I have enclosed the link to the contents of the Clean Air Act so you can read it yourselves. Otherwise it is like playing Russian Roulette...sometimes you win...and sometimes you get caught...I don't like the odds or the price tag.

 

[oldace84]

Sounds really good...dosen't it.....but of course we all know that the smog nazi's will get us if we try to do this.....yes it will give improved HP.....and a smoother running engine with more available HP.....But big brother is watching us........
To bad.....
Wish I could do it.....But!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So much for that...
tony