Cornering your C4

[sothpaw]

For everyone with a C4,

I had a fun experience with mine this weekend, I highly recommend it to everyone, even if performance isn't your thing.

I took it to a nice wide open parking lot, away from residential
areas, on a Sunday, with no one around.

I had enough room to go straight for aways, and turn at 20-30
mph, and then feel the corner and listen to the tires.

I must say that the GSC's are not crap like everyone says. They
make noise before giving away,and when they do start to give
it up, it is graceful and the driver remains in control.

Highly recommended.

 

[69autoXr]

There is a legitimate, legal and sanctioned way to experience the same feeling you had, in a competitive environment. It is called autocross, where a miniature road course is set up using traffic cones in a large parking lot, and the object is to drive the course as fast and smoothly as possible without knocking down any of the cones. Such autocross events are sanctioned by NCCC, SCCA(SCCA calls it Solo 2), and many other local sports car clubs. You will experience the thrill of driving at your and your car's limit, and improving your driving skills at the same time. I highly recommend you give it a try, it's a blast.

Chris

 

[Vettelt193]

For everyone with a C4,

I had a fun experience with mine this weekend, I highly recommend it to everyone, even if performance isn't your thing.

I took it to a nice wide open parking lot, away from residential
areas, on a Sunday, with no one around.

I had enough room to go straight for aways, and turn at 20-30
mph, and then feel the corner and listen to the tires.

I must say that the GSC's are not crap like everyone says. They
make noise before giving away,and when they do start to give
it up, it is graceful and the driver remains in control.

Highly recommended.

Glad you had fun!

GSC's were great tires when they came out in 1992, but technology has come a long way since then... even the cheapest tire now is better than some of the best tires from the early '90s. So, GSC's aren't really crap, they are just crap by comparison to new tires.

 

[Edmond]

Re: Re: Cornering your C4

Glad you had fun!

GSC's were great tires when they came out in 1992, but technology has come a long way since then... even the cheapest tire now is better than some of the best tires from the early '90s. So, GSC's aren't really crap, they are just crap by comparison to new tires.

Not to mention a dollar for dollar comparison.

 

[sothpaw]

69,

I've auto crossed twice before, but I would still recommend this especially to new autocrossers.

Things happen fast when you are on a course. You are concentrating on the next corner.
This way, you can really fixate on how the car handles as the tires begin to loose traction.

I will also try it again in the rain and with every new set of tires to see how they feel.

 

[Moonunit 451]

This actually brings up a question that I've been really interested in as a rookie Vette owner. Ya know, I can easily figure out what my car is going to do at 20- 30 MPH. That's really inconsequencial. What I'm more interested in is what it will do at speeds where if you F - up, you die.

I've heard that it'll push or the back end will go away (under-over steer) at speed. I'm driving a relatively stock car. I want to know what it does at 90 + when you go over the line. what should, could I expect. Breaking loose at 5o or 60 doesn't really tell you much driving hard. I'll have to go to a track, I'm sure to find the answer, and I'm planning on doing that .

I've got original 86 wheels with Dunlop 8000's which I think are EXCELLENT tires, but I just don't know what will happen when I break em' out at HIGH speed. ANYONE?

 

[SPANISHVETTS]

!!!DRIVING SCHOOL!!!

I work with kids that grow up to be F1 drivers, most recently Justin Wilson. Not a single one of them have ever learned it on their own.

The skills to drive a car on the edge of the envelope, like the skills to fly an airplane at max performance are learned and practiced. There is no such thing as a natural, sure some people have better eye sight, eye to hand coordination, or strength but at the end of the day the person with the best training and most recent experience is the best driver.

About once a year I get in a few laps with a PRO in the right seat. It is always a humbling experience to realize how much I do not know and how many bad habits I have developed in such a short time.

If you want to know how to drive your Vette when it enters ¨all dimensional instability¨, spend your next vacation in a hi-performance driving school. For those who insist on doing it on their own in an uncontrolled environment, I hope Daryllawman is close by with his ticket book and cuffs. The life he saves may be mine!!!

BTW My 90 Z51 with Dunlops is like a slot car, the rear end sends faxes that it is unhappy long before any thing bad happens. This is a rare occurrence because the body flex already has me on the cell phone complaining about life close to 1G.

 

[Moonunit 451]

Good points SPANISHVETTS all. I wish I could afford such luxuries, but this car is already eating more time and money than I have to give. But, Portland International Raceway is in my back yard and I understand some of the local clubs get track time once or twice a year. I'm hoping that might afford the opportunity to get on the 2 mi road course alone or close to it. There is a lot of open space on several of the corners where if you were to loose it bigtime you probly wouldn't hit anything. I'm not interested in wrecking my car or hurting anyone. I'm more curious what it will do when it breaks loose. I've heard a lot of different statements regarding the characteristics of these cars.

I've owned a couple of early RX-7's and the car handled very well. When it would start to break loose it was very easy to deal with, but that was a much lighter very well balanced car. A whole different feel. I've had other cars that were pretty easy to figure out as well. This Vette has my respect,but I'd like to feel more comfortable. I think that the weight and the way it seems to pull more g's than any other car I've driven is what is so discomforting. Hey, why even own a sports car if you ain't gonna push it now and then? Ya know:Roll

 

[Mad-Mic]

first off why do you want to push your car to the point to where you wreck it?

i cant tell you with your 16 inch wheels what it will do but for mine on 17 inch wheels with 285's all the way around there is a loose condition where the rear end wants to push out and come around. i only experienced this once and that was enough for me. this happened on a banked high speed turn at around 80 mph. i'm sure the enbankment had something to do with this as i have not experienced it on level turns then again i don't take high speed turns to the point my tires are deafly squeeling either.

all in all i think i only pressed my vette to about 80% of it's ability with the other 20% waiting for summit point raceway later this year. i've taken turns in my Z/28 at high speeds dirt tracking around the turns at over 80mph before but in the vette it would be too expensive to fix if i busted the fiberglass up. this is the biggest reason i haven't pushed it any harder.

 

[CKA_Racing]

Oh sothpaw!
You do realize SCCA runs autocross events at FedEx field?
Also you can come out to our corvette club events. We run autox on a stock car banked oval track.

 

[Vettelt193]

Oh sothpaw!
You do realize SCCA runs autocross events at FedEx field?
Also you can come out to our corvette club events. We run autox on a stock car banked oval track.

I wouldn't want to do it without knowing what my car will do... there are people around, and someone could potentially get hurt if I mess up... All I am trying to say is I understand where sothpaw is coming from. An empty parking lot with no one around is even safer than what SCCA can provide.... there is no one around, and no constraints to follow, so you can learn at your own pace with the security of not killing anyone.

 

[CKA_Racing]

Vettelt193, Please don't take this as a flame. You are making it sound like autoxing is very dangerous. Sure anything can be if the proper procedures are not taken. Like standing right next to cones or where cars can spin out. Crossing the street will get you killed in a heart beat also if you don't turn your head to look for oncoming traffic. But with your kind of thinking I don't see how you would ever even attend any type of race event even as a spectator let alone cross the street. Spectators get killed by flying parts and peds by buses :L

In regards to doing it in a parking lot on your own. How can you prevent some kid flying up on his bike to get a closer look at the action? How do you prevent some one from appearing out of no where and driving into the lot way too close? How's that safer than a controlled event?

Part of autoxing is learning what you and your car can do. If you go out the first time and drive like you are insane, then of course something can happen. I commend you though for not wanting to see others get hurt. cheers!

BTW, you'd love our club events. All workers are behind a guard rail at all times except to upright cones.

 

[poorboys831]

Just to answer the question,sort of,without any morality issues-I put my '93 ,almost stock,into a right corner sharp,snap the wheel turn ,at 35 the other day and kept my foot on the gas without letting up and with the ASR off.The car just took it-Not even a hint of letting loose- threw a bunch of stuff in the car all around but it hugged the road like it was glued there.Quite a feeling!I drove a MGB a long time ago and it would come around in a strong wind.Had a fiat that would leave the road and try and fly there is nothing like a Vette Dennis

 

[sothpaw]

CKA,

Yes, I know about those AutoX's at Fedex, I will probably go to
some. I like the NCCC events better because they are put on
by vette owners and so the courses are more tailored to our
cars and not Honda accords: there are straights!

--I have to agree strongly with vettelt193. That is why I posted
this. At my first autocross, I was so concerned with not getting
a DNF (which I still got 2 of 3 runs) that I didn't even begin to
push the car. I was afraid. I didn't know what it would do.
It wasn't much fun.

--The environment I picked was safe. It was free of that kid
on a bike because that kid doesn't frequent this industrial area.
There is no residential housing within 1 mile of this place. No
reason for him to come. Plus, the way this lot is arranged, there
is only one way in and one out--I will see him way before he
gets close to me.

 

[Cire96]

I agree with all the others who've recommended autocrossing as the way to get a good feel for what your Vette will do. It's fun, safe and relativley easy on equipment. And if you can get an experienced racer to ride in the passenger seat, you'll be amazed at what you'll learn. I'll be at the local SCCA AX event this Sunday trying to get out of my #2 points standing position in A stock.

Recently (April 14/15) I attended a two day high speed driving event run by TracQuest at Mid Ohio road course. It took the Autox experience to a whole new level. Leaping on the brakes at 125 MPH with 400 feet to go before making a 90 degree right, will make you forget all about everything but that corner. I highly recommend the experience. They run events all around the country. I think thier web site is tracquest.com.
Cire96

 

[vettepilot]

I think what Sothpaw and Vettelt193 are trying to say.. ask... or thinking about is how does one have "fun" with his/her Vette without having to compete in a santioned event. For those who enjoy sanctioned events, and the accociated competition that's great... but for somebody on a limited budget high performance driving schools, and sanctioned events might be the straw that broke the bank account.
There is always the argument of the safety issue..... and the cost of repairing body material if the "fun" turns into a wreck, but here is where there needs to be an in-between area. A free or low cost access to an open parking lot, track, or deserted airstrip that allows for somewhat unbridled fun, but restricts entry of non-participating vehicles, bicycles skateboards etc.
There are virtually dozens of abandoned airstrips, old Lowes, Wal-Mart, and K-Mart parking lots. One just has to find the owner and request access for an afternoon of self-policed funfilled spinouts and hard cornering.
Many Corvette Clubs and other local Auto Clubs might be helpful in making contact with the owner of such areas, and the local Law Enforcment officials to make sure no tresspassing and/or reckless driving tickets are issued to the participants.
You might be surprised how much fun is out there for free.

vettepilot

 

[rrubel]

One word: liability. No Walmart is going to let you use their parking lot for fear of lawsuit. An abandoned airstrip might be good, but depending on who owns it you've got the same issue.

[RICHR]