distributor update

[BarryK]

I sent my distributor out to be recurved. This thing has been giving me major tuning and timing issues since I bought the car.
The person I sent it too is someone from the NCRS discussion board who has a Sun distributor machine.

From past experiences already I really HATED the idea of sending anything else out to anyone, but I knew that i'd never get this thing fixed correctly without it being on a Sun machine so had no real choice and NO ONE, i mean NO ONE local has a Sun machine.

well, he recieved the distributor today and looked it over. He hasn't even gotten it on his Sun machine yet but already said he sees some major issues with it.
first of all, he says the cam assembly is not the correct one is is actually off a '69 truck!! that itself goes a long way in explaining why the curve is all wrong and is too long (too many degrees of advance). I knew from my own readings that it was giving me 32* of mechanical advance rather than the correct 24*. The good news is he says he has the correct cam assembly I need or at least one very close to it. That should make a big difference right there.

One other thing is he noticed was it has a later model style rotor on it than the '65-66 cars used. The difference, (other than color) is the tip is about 1/16 of an inch shorter than the 60's style moving it that much farther away from the pin in the distributor cap. Requires higher voltage to jump the gap from the tip of the rotor to the pin in the cap that connects to the wires.
I just bought that rotor from Paragon and installed it in Dec but if it's wrong it's wrong and he will install a correct one.

He should have it on the Sun machine Wed and we will see what else he finds.

Barry

 

[vintagecorvette]

What does he charge to put it on his Sun machine?


oWEN

 

[BarryK]

i'll find out...........

actually, if nothing is seriously wrong and it doesn't take him too long to just put it on and do a simple recurve I THINK it's around $50-$75.

mine will most likely be a bit more since we already know he is going to have to dig into his stockpile of parts and replace some things inside.

If you need, PM or email me and I'll give you his info. He is retired and he just does this on the side so I don't know if he wants me to post his info up in public and maybe get swamped with a ton of requests for work but i'm sure a few private inquiries would be fine.

 

[vintagecorvette]

Thanks, but I luckly have a SUN machine in the family. Have used many times in the past, It is a great old tool that would be hard to replace. Just curious what someone gets to do the job.

oWEN

 

[BarryK]

your a lucky man.

a friend of mine asked around for me also and actually was able to find someone that has TWO Sun machines but he uses neither of them so he has them in storage.
I may try to find out if he would sell me one of them so I'll have one to use when needed.

 

[paul67]

You are lucky. I cannot find a SUN machine in this city of 1 million people.

 

[BarryK]

Paul
these seem to be the ONLY Sun machines around and they aren't being used, they are sitting in a storage warehouse!
that's why I want to see if maybe he would sell me one.

you know, even the biggest machine shop/engine rebuilder around doesn't have one or know where one is.
If I could buy one of these machines from this guy and learn how to use it properly, I could probably make some side $$$ doing work like recurving distributors for local people, hot rodders, other vettre owners, etc.
who knows. I'm learning other things so who says I can't learn more about distributors and running a Sun machine?

 

[vintagecorvette]

I know a guy in San Diego that buys them and rebuilds them. They demand big $$$. I not only have the distributor machine in the family, but the whole Sun Scope. It is pretty cool.


oWEN

 

[BarryK]

figures they bring big money now......... one of the machine shops/engine rebuilders local to here told me that they used to get them used when they needed one for $100.
They used to have about 6 of them in the shop than of course eventually barely needed them so when they broke they just took them to the dump.

oh well........

 

[jims427400]

Barry, Can you tell what problems your were having before w/ your dist.Was it missfiring?Just currious becuase if I time mine to specs and it still runs like crap,maybe its my distributor.I too am trying to do more myself after our carb fiasco.
Can you post name/address of the guy you used . Thanks, Jim

 

[BarryK]

Jim
I knew the distributor was an issue since I bought the car. I was told the day I bought it it was going to need to be recurved and no matter who looked at it or tried to fix it it was never right.
After re-doing my engine compartment and getting everything back together ealier this winter I tried to set the timing the best I could. From my readings and following Johnz's tech paper I could see the the distributor was giving me 32* of mechanical advance. That's WAY too much and the specs for my motor only call for 24* of mechanical advance. I knew it was time to finally get this resolved so was able to find someone with a Sun distributor machine from the NCRS board. I searched locally and no one has a sun maching local to me.

The person I sent it to is well known in the NCRS world. He just does it as a side thing for people so I don't know if it's proper I post his name in a public forum. I'm not sure he wants to get swamped with requests but if you need his services PM or email me and i'll give you his info.
he is in your state actually. I'm not sure how far his town is from yours but who knows, he may even be real close to you.

I really HATED sending anything else on my car out to depend on someone else doing a decent job but with no Sun Machines local to me I had no choice.
As you can see from my post, it was already worth it I think as he's identified wrong parts in my unit and they are most likely contributing to the problem on my curve.

 

[maxphunn]

If I could buy one of these machines from this guy and learn how to use it properly, I could probably make some side $$$ doing work like recurving distributors for local people, hot rodders, other vettre owners, etc.
who knows.

Barry, that is why I bought mine, for a retirement project. But it is not Sun, it is an Allen Syncrograph. This weekend at a small auto fleamarket in Paris Ontario I found an original user's manual for it. Now if I could just find a collection of old GM distributor springs. Pat

 

[BarryK]

cool
is it relatively easy to use?

 

[maxphunn]

cool
is it relatively easy to use?

So far it is, at least to check what you already have and to see what you get with different springs and vac cans.

The trick is knowing what you want, what works best for your car. I found some AEA tune up charts for Corvettes at another vendors table. They show
what advance° @ 3 different rpm the factory called for. I have also been saving posts from John Z and others with their suggestions for advance, vacuum etc.

I think you should get one

 

[maxphunn]

Oh Barry....

There are about 4 distributor machines on eBay (are we aloud to say that?) right now. Search distributor tester.

 

[BarryK]

thanks for the info

 

[BarryK]

I heard from my distributor guy yesterday and got the results he found from the distributor as I sent it to him from the Sun machine. WOW! no wonder my car never ran as well as I expected it to.

Curve as is:

0@500
0@1000
14@1500
24@2000
30@2500
32@3000

Curve it SHOULD be:

0@700
1-3@800
13-17@1500
24-28@2850 (all in)

That's pretty BAD compared to the correct factory curve.
I knew it was giving me 32* mechanical advance from my own readings on it but man, that thing was all messed up! :eek

In addition he found the lower bushing was very worn and the mainshaft scored not to mention as I posted previously that the cam assembly was from a '69 truck!
The main shaft and lower bushing was upsetting to hear about since they were installed approx 1,500-2,000 miles ago if that much! These were repro parts so once again we can see the "quality" of typical repro parts that are available for us to buy for our nice Corvettes.

luckily when I had my local mechanic rebuild the distributor less than two years ago and all the new parts went in I saved all the old parts out of it and the original mainshaft is still in good enough condition to be reused along with a few of the other parts. What parts he needs to make it right and I don't have he does as he has a nice stock of original parts for these things.
So...... based on what he found and reusing correct original parts back in the distributor and getting the cirve correct should make a nice difference I'm hoping in the way the car runs.

 

[Bwmurph]

Barry,

Sounds like this guy is doing a nice job on your distributor; hope it makes a big difference in the way the car runs. You stayed with the corrects points, condenser, rotor, correct ? I wonder if the guy will re-curve my old dual point that I converted to breakerless ignition ?

Also, how is the carb re-build coming ? I haven't been around much lately and when I have I've been working 10 - 12 hours a day (including Sat & Sun) so I don't know what's going on.

later,

Bernie O.

 

[BarryK]

Hi Bernie!

yep, seems like he knows what he's doing with the distributor.
He didn't indicate that the points and condensor were wrong but if they are I basically just told him to make that thing right and put in what it needs.
The rotor was incorrect he said which didn't make me happy as the rotor and cap are brand new and I just put them on in Jan as the car was going back together. They came from Paragon.

don't know about your breakerless distributor but if you want his info to contact him and ask let me know and i'll email it to you.

still waiting on the new transfer tube and sleeves and the fuel bowl washers/seals so I can get the carb back together. Thanks for the reminder, I'll call the speedshop today and see if they came in.

I'm running out now to an exhaust repair shop as I need them to slightly expand the necks of my starter collars. The new sintered iron donuts I got don't fit right and slide all the way off the tops of the collars!. Gotta love aftermarket products, they never fit right!

BTW, I got a sample now of those colored blankets so if you want to stop by sometime and take a look just let me know. You mentioned a while back you had a nice color pic you were interested in doing on a blanket.