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engine trouble--need opinions

  • Thread starter Thread starter sothpaw
  • Start date Start date
I was just thinking...If the cat(s) are bad, you should also replace the oxygen sensors too.

Quick question...How long have you used the Hypertech chip?
I'm thinking that this may have added a little more fuel.
We'll know for sure if you can get a scan tool. We can see how this chip is affecting the situation.
 
Nick,
Thanks for your assistance! The hyper tech chip is gone now, it was on there almost 4 years though. Now I have an Ed wright fast chip.

I do hit a lot of bumps, the suspension is stiff and the roads here are poor in places I have to go. I actually bought a commuter car partially for that reason--afraid the Corvette would shake itself to death.
 
I should add, just to be clear:

The engine runs normal at start up and driving, as long as it is cool. As soon as the engine hits 190-192 oil temp, all __breaks loose, the engine starts running rougher and rougher and in a few minutes will stall.
 
Beg, borrow, or steal(just kidding) a scan tool. See if there's any codes present. Let's attack this first. You may have a sensor that may be affected by the engine heat, and that includes your chip that you installed, and/or even your computer. If your lucky, the computer may have stored a code.
I'm starting to lean away from the blocked cats situation for now.
I'm just curious, do you still have the OEM chip. If you do, I would install it to see how the car reacts.
Keep me posted.
 
I'm just thinking, when the car cuts out... are you getting spark out of the ignition coil? Just disconnect the coil wire from the distributor, position it about 1 inch away from a metal surface, crank the engine while someone or you watches for a nice blue spark, if any.
I apologize...I think that I have overlooked the obvious. I guess I got drawn into the blocked cats discussion.

Let's attack the basics first.
 
If you can't get to the distributor (too hot) , just disconnect a plug wire to check for spark.
 
Nick Rinaldi said:
Beg, borrow, or steal(just kidding) a scan tool. See if there's any codes present.

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but that comment, and the recent experience I had causes me to bring this up.

I don't know about the rest of the country, but here in California, Autozone no longer will check your codes for you. Evidently, from the way I hear it, BAR (Bureau of Automotive Repair) won't allow them to do it anymore because they are not a garage, and they are not qualified BAR mechanics. Pep Boys are still allowed to do it because they are a repair facility and they charge you for the service.

I've been trying to find someone to pull a code for me on my truck, but everybody wants a hundred bucks or so just to pull a code! Those Bastards!! :mad

Rant off. I now return you to your regular programming. ;)
 
Nick,

You're talking about ECM/CCM codes, correct? I pulled them as soon as it happened, the very first time--I have Gordon KilBrew's handout(code listing) and the little plugs (you plug them in under the dash).

There were no codes present the ECM, CCM, or anything else, save for an H74 code in the CCM, which I have seen before and is unrelated.

So, the fact that it runs fine (seems to have power and good idle and everything) and then dies when it warms up, that is not a tell tale sign? I would think a bad electric fuel pump or injector would always be bad, regardless of temperature. Same for the opti.

What changes when the engine warms up? What is temperature dependent?
 
Ken-I'm sorry to hear about the politics in California. Scan tools are expensive. The good ones cost about $3,000 and about another $1,000 a year to keep up to date. That explains the high price to pull codes. The whole process takes about 5 minutes. The problem with code pulling is that sometimes codes don't tell you the whole story with the car. In other words, the tool and info it supplies is only as good as the person using it.

Sothpaw - I'll tell you where I'm going in my mind with your problem. It's possible that the ignition coil or the driver module could be crapping out after getting hot. That's why I don't want to jump into the cats yet. When a vehicle doesn't start,it's because of the lack of air, fuel or spark. This is assuming the mechanicals are OK. I think it's safe to assume your problem is not mechanical.
The coil driver module, just like the rest of the electronics on your car are made with solid state(non-moving) parts. The nonmoving parts makes them consistent and reliable. The big problem with them is that they are also very delicate. That means that unless they are electrically fried, they will fail when exposed to heat and vibration. The electronics are mounted on small ceramic bases and their connections are through tiny (sometimes microscopic) solder joints. If the solder didn't flow right when it was made, or if the ceramic base becomes weak or cracked, when exposed to high heat, things tend to move. When this happens, sometimes the circuit opens and causes a temporary failure. When the unit cools, everything returns to normal. Thus the intermittent problem.
The spark test is the easiest and most logical test to do at this point. Trust me!
 
Nick,
A cracked board might make sense. I had a cracked one in a receiver once, and it would work except below a certain temperature.
 
Sounds good! When do think you'll be able to check for spark?
I'll try to be around.
 
Nick,
It's ok, no need to stay around for me. If it's easy to disconnect the ignition coil wire, I will do it this weekend. Otherwise, I have
a very resonable shop which will diagnose this for me at low cost.
 
OK! Good luck! If you need me just let me know.
Nick
 
Let me add some more details to this. Yesterday Sothpaw dropped by to pick up the gauges and he drove the Vette down. Almost didn't make it...

Anyway, as he said, it's fine when cool but as soon as the temp gauge crosses 190 (even at idle), you start hearing pops from the exhaust and soon after the idle gets rough and jumps around. Not long after that, I started hearing a hissing sound from under the hood, near the air cleaners (he has an SLP Claw). The hissing got louder as the idle got worse, and eventually the car stalled. On restart, it ran fine for a couple minutes and started the hissing again. I blipped the throttle from under the hood and got a massive BANG (backfire/frontfire?) out of the air cleaner. After that, it ran smoothly again for a while even though the temp was over 190.

Does this shed any more light?

[RICHR]
 
The next time, start the car and feel the exhaust coming from both tail pipes. Then when you hear the hissing, see if you feel a noticable difference at the pipes (one or both). If you do feel a lot less, then I'll bet one or both cats are blocking up.
The hissing and the backfire is the engine choking up from back pressure. You don't want that to happen too often. If you use a vacuum gauge, you should start to see the vacuum starting to drop when it chokes up.
 
I did feel the tailpipes before the hissing started, but didn't think to check them afterwards.

Was looking for a good vacuum line to test; was going to use the one under the passenger-side fuel rail cover but had to answer to family needs. Sothpaw is supposed to check this and get back to me.

I'm assuming the stall is from choking itself to death?

[RICHR]
 
Nick,
I didn't get to checking the vacuum, Frustration set in from getting it home. I'm also supposed to be painting...

...and like you said, if it is a clogged cat, then I must know which one and why.

Does anyone think a clogged exhaust fits this scenario? I may just order both cats and return what I don't need, just to speed up the process...
 

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