Help! Oh man.. No, not the right time to be doing this, even though you are 30..

[82ColEd]

Howdie all..
Yeah, i know, only coming by when i got an issue.

Tuesday, i wanted to drive home from coming from Ankara. Hop in the car, starts right, no sweat, yeah, going home after 5 days of 33C in the heat working over the weekend.. After 5 minutes of driving, car is warmed up at new normal temp of 190F, she starts bogging down. hit fun pedal roars up, doesnt go anywhere.. WTF? :ughad

So, i creep over the crossing, stalling, hitting the revs to 3-4k to keep her running, crawling at 30kph until i can park her on the side. Rats.. I look around, nothing obvious. The only thing i can see is the oil dipstick is full of oil to the middle of the dipstick. WERD..

Ok, call the wifey, tell her i'll be a bit. I crawl home on back streets, flashers going, stalling out, revving up, making a scene all the way home. Trying to ignore the clunking that happens once in a while (flinching everytime it does it). Now she is in the Garage. I only had a cursery look, oil dipstick: Same still, cold or warm. Double WERD!!

I pulled 2 spark plugs to see if my usual cylinder is making a ruccus.. Nope, a bit oily on the threads as usual, but the head grey and okay. Checked other fluids, seems normal.

When i start her up, it seems fine. I ran a WINALDL and all data suggests normal, but i didnt get her our of the geeerage, as i dont want to be stranded again. I havent been that brave.

Also i have zero time. I gotta go to Moscow on Monday. Any advise from the experts here? Feels like someone dropped a half pound sugar in the tank, but the spray on the bowls is normal (yeah, i checked, dont ask why )..

So only thing must be inside, the only thing that weirds me out is the Oil on the dipstick and it's a bit wet under the car.. Maybe the Tranny blew? I can seem to shift Park to D, no worries there, it goes into it's usual bending down at the knees and seems ot be strong.. am lost.. Not that that is new..

Help.. pls pls.

Thanks Gang!
-Stefan

 

[killain]

Slow problems ?

You have a bad fuel pump which has the diaphram rubtured. It ha leaked into your crankcase. I advise 1. don't run the engine as the oil is contaminated with motor oil, 2 remove the fuel pump and replace with a new one. 3. Drain the Motor oil and filter with fresh oil and a new oil filter. This happens every once inawhile, not a big problem, but don't run the engine as the oil is diluded with Gasoline.

 

[larryg3]

I do believe that the 82 vette has the L83 engine so it would have an electric fuel pump located in the fuel tank to feed the cross fire fuel injection. You should definitely not run the engine again until you figure out the cause. what is the coolant level?

 

[Peer81]

Yes, 82's have electric fuelpumps inside the fueltank so no contact between the inside of the engine and fuel (besides combustion).
I would say, if you're sure the engine is running very strange then the problem is in the engine. When you blow your transmission the engine will still be running good.
The only time I had the same symptomes that you have (but I have a carb) is when the engine is in a full rich condition, almost drowning in it's own fuel).
With my A/F ratio meter I could see it was doing 1:4 (fuel:air) and normal is 14.5:1...

But it could be a number of different things that could cause this problem. I think a full lean condition would give the same problems.
What it could be, when cold the engine is running in open loop, when the O2 sensor has warmed up the ECM does into closed loop and the O2 sensor output is controlling the mixture. If your O2 is broken the A/F ratio will be far from perfect! But like I said, there are so many things that can cause this problem.

On the other hand, when having a A/F problem your sparkplugs will have a dark or almost white surface.

I don't know about the oil. Maybe alot of carter pressure could cause this?

Greetings Peter

 

[Vettehead Mikey]

hit fun pedal roars up, doesnt go anywhere.. WTF? :ughad

.............

When i start her up, it seems fine............. Maybe the Tranny blew? I can seem to shift Park to D, no worries there, it goes into it's usual bending down at the knees and seems ot be strong..

Have you had a look at the transmission fluid level?

 

[82ColEd]

Have you had a look at the transmission fluid level?

Tranny Fluid: Good point. Dooh..

I'll go check on that tonight and report..

 

[82ColEd]

k: Tranny Fluid: Check. All nice and red, a little above full actually..

Anything else i could check to pinpoint?

(And you guys' help and suggestions do make it better; doesnt make me feel all alone out here )

 

[82ColEd]

I do believe that the 82 vette has the L83 engine so it would have an electric fuel pump located in the fuel tank to feed the cross fire fuel injection. You should definitely not run the engine again until you figure out the cause. what is the coolant level?

Larry: Coolant: Looks good.. I even removed the cap to check and some leaked out. So, way good on there as well (Not just the overflow tank). When i squeeze the hose, it pushes coolant back into the overflow tank as well.

 

[larryg3]

ok now i am concerned. what is the color of the oil? I the increase of the oil level has to come from somewhere.
what was the oil pressure like when the car started to act up?

 

[Vettehead Mikey]

k: Tranny Fluid: Check. All nice and red, a little above full actually..

Anything else i could check to pinpoint?

(And you guys' help and suggestions do make it better; doesnt make me feel all alone out here )

I'm trying to understand if the engine runs normally or not. It seems that the engine will rev, but the car does not accelerate. True?

 

[82ColEd]

The color of the oil is fairly normal. Darkish brown, I'd say..

Running of the engine: When starting up, the engine runs fine. Normal RPM's, in idle and driving (last time i tried). When she sat idling in the garage, normal range, i can rev fine. What i haven't tried is to let her run until she hits Operating Temp to see if she starts behaving badly. But, basically what happened on Tuesday was i started fine, and drove for about 5 minutes. Then slowing down to a stop, she starting revving, but not going anywhere, then fine, then almost dying, so i hit the pedal and she revved up but went a little before coming to stop, engine stalled out. I turned IGN off, then back on, started fine, hit the pedal, same thing as before: revving the engine i could go for a little bit, but not fast. That way I'd crawl for about 10 minutes, in between she would die, so IGN off, back on, i could hear the starter revving high, then the engine would be running.

I think what I'll do is to run her in the garage tomorrow night (It is night time here now, so no can do now) until she hits OT and grab some ODB data via WinALDL to see if she throws any codes (She hasn't thrown a code even going through the brutal going home crawl). All that time, i was able to shift gears, P-N-D, no probs. Once the engine ran, D would go forward, so nothing unusual there.

 

[Yoda]

Stefan,

Only two things I can think of that cause the oil level to go up... three if you count overfilling it, but to the point ONE would be Gas, Two would be Water... Gas you should be able to smell in the oil and the oil will be thinner than normal. Water tends to mix and cause foam/bubbles and turns the oil chocolate brown color.

Years ago I hit something in the road and took out the sense's around the flywheel of my 635csi. Being in Nebraska, I ended up using Porsche sense's as the right ones weren't available. Well I ended up "Washing the Cylinders" and had as much gas as oil in the oil.. ended up renting a U-Haul and trailer at Laramie, WY and towing the beast back to CA.

From my shade tree mechanic knowledge it sounds like the car runs but doesn't move properly??? that sounds like a transmission issue, that would NOT explain the over full Oil

Good Luck bro...

Bud

 

[tmkassin]

I would start by checking timing and compression on all cylinders. Next step is check the fuel pressure. By the symptoms you describe it does not sound like a tranny problem. How long has it been since you replaced the fuel filter?

 

[Vettehead Mikey]

I'm having a tough time understanding what the OP is saying, possibly too much slang or vague terminology and not enough clear language. No offence intended and I know that English is not the OP's first language so this is not meant to be critical.

"Then slowing down to a stop, she starting revving, but not going anywhere, then fine, then almost dying, so i hit the pedal and she revved up but went a little before coming to stop, engine stalled out."

Seems to say that at one point that the engine speed was increasing on it's own, but that the car was not moving. The problem then resolved itself, followed by the engine (almost) quitting but responded to the gas pedal before stalling.

Pretty hard to say what could possibly wrong.

I'm also confused about the oil level. Did it increase on it's own above the full mark on the dipstick? Even of the answer is yeas, this doesn't explain the other antics of the car.

 

[Peer81]

I think it would make sense to spit the important things from the minor things.
From the things I'm reading I see what is happening from time to time, but I don't see any details on how the engine is reacting? Is the engine stumbling, bogging, shuttering, tries to die etc etc?

When the engine is doing all sorts of bad things it would be logical that there is no speed increase when hitting the gas as the engine is having a hard time on its own to stay alive.
If the engine is running fine but when hitting the gas nothing happens then I would say, focus on the tranny.

So Stefan, if I where you. Please rewrite what has happend almost from minute to minute, what you felt, how the engine felt, car felt, what you heard etc etc. The more info we have the easier it is for us to send you into the right direction.

Greetings Peter

 

[82ColEd]

Alright. i did a few more tests today and ran the car. Here is the findings (Hopefully in better car speak):

When starting the engine, she is idling okay, though a bit rough. The RPMs are at the correct level though go up and down a few hundred every 10-20 seconds or so. The engine rumbles a bit, like she is missing a cylinder (I had the same when a spark plug fouled). See the gif for the RPM range over time
View attachment RPMs.gif

With the WinALDL running (If someone is good at reading that data, let me know, i'll email it), i drove her out of the garage and down the driveway. Halfway down (It's about 150 feet long) i pushed the throttle and the engine almost died. She idles fine and slowly drives in gear, but when i hit the pedal, she would die. So much so, that she would stall once and shut off (see the gif). I reversed on the street, turned around and drove back in: Same thing. She drives along in idle fine, but when i pushed the pedal down she bogged down, after a few seconds of keeping the pedal down, she would rev up and start driving a bit, but then die again.

The more i think about this it appears she doesn't get fuel, at least that's the only thing in my non car mind that would make sense.

Mikey: I think i understand what you are trying to say, though i was never accused of not speaking English well enough. I believe my somewhat 'slang' terminology comes from where i lived in the States and the CAC friends i keep . But it is also, obviously, my lack of proper automotive terms that you are rightly criticizing. Having a mix of German and English words for something is sometimes a hazard. At the same time, i was trying to say what was going on, in more non automotive words.

Peter: Dank je, but i think with testing we'll find more as I certainly wasn't paying too much attention to the cars behavior as to trying to figure out what was wrong at the time and wanting to go home.

tmkassin: That would be an issue, time wise as well as tool wise. I don't have a full toolkit in my garage, with compression testers etc. Shade Tree PC Geek here. Just enough knowledge rumbling around in my head, gathered from 19 years of having her, to be dangerous. :L

What I'll try tomorrow is to have the wifey sit in the drivers seat (Rare occasion) and while she hit's the pedal, I'll watch if the fuel spray cones change (If the fuel is an issue, they should, correct??).

But, it's been a somewhat busy day (Other things) and I'll go and have a drink now.

Again, my thanks to all of you giving me things to think about and try (and being patient with me).


-Stefan

 

[Vettehead Mikey]

Glad you took no offence- explaining technical difficulties is always difficult, never mind doing it in a second language. With this, it sounds like an engine problem and not transmission. Could be a simple fuel pressure/flow problem.

 

[djsroknrol]

It sounds like the same issues I had when I first got my '84, a fuel delivery/pressure problem and not a transmission problem. You might check your inline fuel filter on the frame rail. There is also a regulator between the two TBI's that maintains pressure to the last TBI. that might need replacing.

It's a hard job, but you really need a factory service manual and a fuel pressure tester to pin it down....good luck with finding it

 

[Peer81]

Hello Stefan,

No problem, as Mike and DJ say I also think it's a fuel problem. What you can do it jack up the car and let your wife push the thottle (in gear) when you look at the fuel cones if there will remain nice cones. Here in Holland we have a good Crossfire guy so I can give him a call maybe he can help you with some tips. I'm more a Quadrajet guy but he has alot of stuff to get a Crossfire right
If you want I also have a A/F ratio meter I can send to you, that way you can see if fuel (to much of not enough) is the problem.

Greetings Peter

 

[wishuwerehere82]

Stephan,

From the sound of your description of the problem, it could be a lot of possible things with the engine controls and monitor system. From the CTS sensor, that would cause your mixture to be all wrong for the temperature range, to a bad TPS that would also cause the stalling and dying with the throttle open.
I'm going to suggest checking the central point where all of these sensors are joined and could be the culprit. The ECM. All of the sensors are connected to the ECM by 2 wire harnesses that run from the engine to the ECM box.
The ECM is behind the drivers seat in the battery compartment and mounted to the front wall of the enclosure.
You will need to take the battery out in order to access it, but once you're in there it is held in place with 4 nuts, or screws, I forget.
Remove it from mounting place, and take a look at the wire harnesses that are connected to it. They are 2 long connectors that clip onto the ECM box. The connector fingers can get corroded and also the edges of the PC board of the ECM. The ECM box is easy enough to open by taking a couple screws out, and you can see the card edge contacts better that way.
Clean up the PC board contacts with a pencil eraser, and spray some electronics contact cleaner into the connectors and blow any dirt out of them.
After everything is dry, reassemble it all back together and try it out.
It may just possibly cure the problem.
BTW, clean up the power distribution terminals (Where the fuse is) next to the battery while you have the battery out. That will give you a more reliable power connection to the ECM and fuel pump.

If your problem persists, at least you have eliminated bad ECM contacts from the equation.

Good luck!