Help! Oh man.. No, not the right time to be doing this, even though you are 30..

[GerryLP]

Stefan!!!!

How are you, my friend? Long time no see nor hear from you, lol. gosh your baby must be 8 or 9 years old? Have you added any more kids since [to your family]?

Man, what you are describing sounds so familiar to what has happened to me before. The trick is to related to a throttle-body set up.

Defintely there is likely one more way to get fuel into your crankcase, and that is through the positive crankcase venting valve. The fact you mentioned that it was hot weather reminded me of this. If pressure builds up in the fuel tank, it will enter through the fuel evaporation system (from tank to charcoal cannister to engine). Now, even though you have a throttle body setup, I am suspecting that a hose from the charcoal cannister connects to the the dual throttle body air cleaners because the fuel fumes would be routed for burning with the engines normal combustion process, yes? The quick "solution" for this is twist loose the fuel tank filler cap to prevent build up. The fuel tanks are supposed to be lined with a bladder and I feel that high heat Makes the bladder separate from the walls of the tank and push fuel through the venting system.

The oil level question is important. Let the engine settle a few minutes after running or check it in the morning. If it is above the full mark, then drain some. This will allow you to check the appearance of the oil and smell and specially check how oily or runny it may seem to run on a flat piece of metal and/or between your fingers.

I just used the following trick recently, but Peter also suggested a laser temperature gauge. Using bottled water, poke a hole in the cap and while the engine is idling, squirt some on the exhaust manifolds for the cylinders. If the water runs off and not instantly boil off, it means that the cylinder is missing combustion cycles (to varying degrees). A bad ignition wire should not trigger a computer code because the difference between your Vette's computer and the L81's should not be great. So if you find a bad wire or spark plug, this could be causing the rough running.

Yeah, and your English writing was pretty bad in the original posting...lol Are you sure that you didn't drink beer first (out of frustration ad) and then write the post????? Ha,ha,ha...otfl

Is definitely what I would have done

 

[82ColEd]

Hey Guys..
Sorry about not stopping in, Moscow took my attention.. And now the family.. Yey.. Anyone wanna trade? :L:eyerole

Okay, one at a time:
@djsroknrol: Yeah, i think the more i contemplate the issue (One has some time on a 3 hour flight to think), i am leaning more and more to fuel delivery issue.

@Peter: Thanks for the offer, maybe your guy can confirm from what i wrote that the fuel is the direction and possible avenues to follow...

@Pete. Howdie, long time no speak.. Yes and no, i would think: The CTS was replaced 2 years ago and is giving good data when running WinALDL, so i would rule that out (for now anyway) and as to the ECM: I had had major failure with the whole 'Computer' a few years back (ca. 1998-1999) and the whole thing was replaced. They didnt troubleshoot but replacing it fixed whatever ailed it at the time. Again, getting good data from the computer, but could it still be that? Yep, sure, so, onto the mental checklist.. Thanks for the pointers, i will keep them in hand..

@Gerry! Damn dude, it's been too long. Yes my daughter is going to be 8 in September, starting 2nd Grade in August.. (Means we're getting old ). And no, she's the only one. We got a good one, so we dont want to spoil our luck..
As to your points: Mmmhh. Definitely something to think about. PCV Valve, didnt even think it could go there.. To the bad ignition or spark plug: When i had that in the past, it would shake the engine or car but never starve it under load. So, a definite maybe.. But i think the collapsed liner could be something. It does relate to fuel. Once i am going through the checklist, i will make sure i'll do the checks you suggest, at least, to rule out that direction.
As to having and then writing. Nope, looks like my German/English (UK and US) got a bit mixed up in the heat of the moment. I certainly had a drink afterwards. But i dont go for beer. JD & Coke to kill anything that was left in there. otfl


So, from my thought process in the last few days with all of your guys input, here is where i am at:

I am not sure checking the fuel pressure will make any difference. I do have a tester as well, though i am not sure where to connect it. I used it for vacuum testing a few times, but it is supposed to test for fuel pressure too. But i think i can save myself the trouble. As to people who ask for the Service Manual: Yes, have it laying on Page 6C-2, but it's not very specific in the testing.

I called the parts store on Saturday, to see if they had an inline fuel filter on site. Nope, but in one of the other stores in Germany (Thats a good thing, means it'll only be a few days to get to Frankfurt). So, i will get that in, should be Thursday of Friday and replace that. I know that in the 19 years that i had her now, that was never replaced. So that wont hurt and if that turns out to be the issue, the easiest fix, i would think..

Then if that doesn't do it, i will venture into the tank.. :ugh Gotta say, am a bit scared with fuel. I guess i watched too many movies.

I would think the fuel pump is next, though from reading the service manual, it could be the bladder/liner collapsed or alternatively there is gunck in the tank/strainer. Which means i have to get my hands/arms in there.. After getting the rest of the fuel out.. Not a prospect i am looking forward to..

Gawd i hope it's the inline filter. Though in the 82 world, the 85 fuel pump is an upgrade everyone seems to be doing when they get their car..

Next steps for me: Get the inline filter in and replaced and check: If still faulty, order the 85 fuel pump from the States and go on vacation for 2 weeks. When i get back, replace the pump and check.. Those 2 items are somewhat should-have-dones in the past anyway, so they dont hurt doing. And the car might just run again.

So, i will report back next weekend when i have the filter replaced and can either rule that out and claim success.


All of you: Thank you for the tips and pointers and the good words, it helps a ton!


Stefan

PS: Sorry for the long post, but i am trying to better my english. Kidding.. Just recapping and setting myself for a to do list. But i do hope i am writing a bit clearer now.

 

[82ColEd]

Ah yes: Best laid plans and all that..

Update: The filter didn't get delivered in time before vacation (they sent it to a wrong address). I checked with them from vacation and they returned it to the store in Frankfurt; after a bit of back and forth. So i picked it up yesterday (and a pair of ramps, thinking it would ease access...)

Today, with Wifeys help, trying to get the car onto the ramps: They slide on the garage floor when i get to "almost on there". Great :eyerole. After 3 attempts, i gave up. I don't want to drop the car off the ramps. Maybe they will come in handy someday if i find a spot in front of the garage where they can stand securely. :ugh

Also, after i started the car up after 2 weeks of standing, she took a bit and was really rough, with the battery light on until she revved up. After my failed attempts with the ramps, i did notice oil drops on the floor that she hadn't done since the last trip to the mechanic. Maybe something that is part of the issue, maybe not?!?

So, i jack up the car on the passenger side, take off the right front wheel, secure the front with a jack-stand and crawl under.. Err.. Where i can access the filter, it would sit right over my face. The small rubber hoses that connect it to the fuel line front and back are pretty hard so i would be afraid to pinch them to prevent fuel leakage. Call me chicken, but i don't think i can do this laying on the floor. On a proper lift, yes, standing, but not laying down.

So i will sign up to ADAC (our version of AAA here in Germany) and have it flat-bedded to the mechanic i had it at last time. Meant to sign up anyway, just in case. We'll see if they call it an emergency tow (which would be free) or not (which would cost).

But i want the car back in running order so i can enjoy it. Right now, i feel really crappy about her. She hasnt been washed since last year (I had to fix the antenna motor first, the mast was sticking out) and now this happens. So she looks like crap, doesn't run properly and i got no time.

Sorry for the rant, i will let you guys know what was wrong when i get her back.

Over and out for now.
-Stefan

 

[Toms007]

Well, keep us posted on what they find. Problems like these are frustrating. Did you ever check the fuel pressure regulator? I had similar problems on my 99 Silverado and it turned out the FPR was bad. Replaced it and the problem cleared up.

 

[82ColEd]

Tom: nope, didnt feel like taking apart the rear injector to get to the FPR. It may well contribute to this whole thing, but i would have to find time somewhere to get into it. :ugh

Thanks for the tip though. I'll definetly post up what the mechanic finds.

Stefan

 

[82ColEd]

Figures.. I had signed up for the ADAC thing, and finally got a hold of the mechanic yesterday to tell him that i'll be having the car dropped off. He's super busy this week and cant take the car on, but he suggested (strongly, though he cant be 100% sure) that it's the fuel pump.

So, what i'll do (As it was part of my list to do anyway) is to get 85 pump and replace mine. I should be able to do that bit (I have good directions from a xfire site), then we'll see if he's right or not.

That should happen tomorrow (hopefully!). I'll be off next week to yet another place, then back for a few days before going away again.
:eyerole
Wish me luck!


-Stefan

 

[GerryLP]

Stefan,

I really hope that you get a chance to clear up tge problem, for summer is waining down, and you won't get as much time to enjoy your ride.

I don't ever recall having a fuel pump acting weak. They either run or not. About a year ago, my daughter was driving my truck, and it died on her at a stop light near the house, so she called me, and of course I darted to rescue her from the situation, and when I tried to start the truck it just cranked over but it would not fire up. Luckily, my truck has dual fuel tanks, and all it took for it to start up was to switch over the tank selector switch and it fired up right away.

Unfortunately, that option was not available with our Vettes, but it only illustrates that, for me, fuel pumps have either worked or not. I never have had one go weak on me an sort of work.

Wow, two week vacation? No wonder you don't want to waste them on your Vette. That sounds like a fun summer.

 

[Peer81]

Well, summer here in northen Europe isn't that sunny as we hoped for... :ugh

Good luck with the fuel pomp! Shouldn't be to difficult I hope.

Greetings Peter

 

[jimbil208]

Replace the temperature sensor on the right front of the engine.

 

[82ColEd]

Well, summer here in northen Europe isn't that sunny as we hoped for... :ugh

Good luck with the fuel pomp! Shouldn't be to difficult I hope.

Greetings Peter

And again i am proving to myself that i am useless as a car mechanic.. ad

Got the fuel pump and got some shrink tubing for making the electrical connection and set out to get it done.

I pushed the car out of the garage, just in case (Can you tell fuel makes me nervous?) and unbolt the lid and remove the rubber
surround. I unclick the electrical connector and start loosing the screws on the clamps that hold the rubber tubing(s) on the pipes.
All nice and loose i try and pry the rubber hoses off the metal. No movement whatsoever. ad After trying and trying and not
gaining a fraction, I've giving up. Been playing with this for almost 1 hour now. All 3 hoses are rock hard and don't slide at all.

Is there any special trick i am missing? I cant get my fingers in there to pull from the fuel line side and i don't want to use pliers to break them
either.. If you guys have any ideas, let's hear them, i still got daylight here (and tomorrow morning too).

I just her back together and put her in the garage. She still starts and runs, so no change (ie. i didn't mess it up totally).

If i don't get this sorted this weekend, she's going to the mechanic, once i get back on Thursday (Prague).

Am gonna go now and try and cool down. Sorry, am real mad right now. Simple stuff. I'll be back in while..

Replace the temperature sensor on the right front of the engine.

If you mean the CTS, i replaced that about 2 years ago and i get good data from it.


Stefan

 

[jimbil208]

replacing the CTS is a calculated guess and a lot easier than what you are doing now.................

 

[jimbil208]

It's up to you about the CTS, if it was me............................

 

[Peer81]

Hello Stefan,

Last evening I had our Crossfire guy on the phone. First thing he said was as the engine is running fine with cold engine that the temp sensor for the ECM (on top-front of the intake) is 9 out of 10 the problem. I don't know if this is the same as the CTS? On mine the passengerside sensor is for the aux fan. Driver side is for the temp gauge and the top one on the intake is for the ECM.
Changing the fuel pump is always a good idea but for the fuel pomp the capacity is the problem. That is not the problem when your driving at normal speeds or idle.

But like he said, first buy a fuel pressure gauge and connect that in the fuel line somewhere, then you know if the pomp is the problem and if you have enough pressure.
Good luck!

Greetings Peter

 

[jimbil208]

The temperature sensor is on the right side front of the engine......As I said in previous posts.....I would try it. You might be surprised.

 

[82ColEd]

Hey all..

Sorry for the delay, was a bit busy with flying around the country-side.. Prague: Check, Moscow: Check, Accra (Ghana): Check.. :eyerole

I finally called the ADAC (the AAA equivalent here in Germany) and they just flat bedded the car to the mechanic. And because i had signed up in July, the tow was free of charge.. yey..

She is slotted into his work schedule for the 19th, so wont be hearing whats going on until then.

jimbil208: I hear you Buddy, but i asked the parts guys here if they had one and they would have had to get it shipped from the States, ie a few weeks delay anyway. Would be nice if that's all it is, but somehow, with my luck... Lets NOT finish that thought. :ugh

A'ight, just thought i'd update you all. I'll let you guys know when i have News to report.


Stefan

 

[jimbil208]

Thanks for the update,keep us posted.
As I said the temperature sensor was a good try for what it sounded like and rather easy to do.
I had that go bad two times on me and the first time it drove me crazy.
Keep us posted.....good luck.
jimbil208

 

[82ColEd]

Amazing what a 30 year old car can do to a mans grin


I called the mechanic this morning to see what the deal was and he apologized about not calling sooner, as he had the wrong cell number. Car is ready. So i jump out at lunchtime and got my car safely back in the garage at work.

He said that it turned out to be the fuel pump. He suspected other things, but after testing and testing it had to be that. So he dropped the tank, with all thats involved and replaced it. He even saw the tank sticker but when he tried to touch it the first flakes came off so he didnt touch it any further. He ran a test run and blew a breaker. He said it was "only" a 10 so he replaced it with a 15, should i have any trouble, i should go to a 20 on that. But she ran fine afterwards. 3 hours of labour and she is back in my hands.


Coming back from the mechanic i did a bit of speed and i suppose she even went 90+ but i couldnt tell as the needle got stuck on the pin. :L So all is well, we have a new fuel pump..

"Houston: We have liftoff.."

Thanks to y'all again for the help.


-Stefan

 

[Peer81]

Good to hear Stefan!

I hope you can cruise in it with the few nice sunny days we have left this year!

Groeten Peter

 

[GerryLP]

Good to hear Stefan!

I hope you can cruise in it with the few nice sunny days we have left this year!

Groeten Peter

Ditto.

So did the mechanic expressed an opinion why would it happen after warm up? I am so glad you have her back. Time to drive!!!

 

[bill81vette]

Glad its fixed Stephan!!!!!!
Autobahn time!!!!!!