Weiand or Performer.....Now I have an excuse :-)

[sscam69]

Thats for the info Jack, much appreciated.

I am going to try and get this manifold issue resolved this weekend. I will remove one of the valve covers to try and take measurements of the springs.

I'll let you know the outcome!!!


Now you got me excited!!:L

 

[Jack]

more spring checking

Frank:
That method (BTW do it COLD) & spring numbers are valid ... BUT.

Maybe spring numbers are itemized on a receipt/work order. If you can, check with your mechanic & ask what kinda springs were used ... let him state spring numbers used ... you could get a false positive if you specify which numbers you need.

Also, another method to check springs on COLD car: You'll need a dial indicator with 1" range & magnetic base/stand, a set of feeler gages. Fully check at least two exhausts & two intakes ... checking all would be best.

With valve at full closed (tallest) position mount DI with tip on VS retainer ... roll crank thru two revs ... note & record the DI readings at open and closed ... the difference is valve lift (probably somewhere between .400" & .500") ... valve lift with stock L82 cam with stock 1.5:1 rockers is about .450" intake & .460" exhaust.

With valve in full closed position (shortest), measure between coil windings with feeler gage. Do this in at 2 or 3 spots on each spring ... note & record ... probably between .050" & .150" ... also visually estimate difference between bottom of retainer & top of guide (top of seals if yours has them). MINIMUM recommended for either is .060" when valve is full OPEN, COLD.

Now for the math. Let's pretend you have .460" lift @ valve but want to change to .480". The difference between the two (in this case .020") is how much tighter the spring gets closed and how much closer the retainer comes to guide. Let's pretend your feeler gage had read .060" ... so with the new cam it'll close down to .040" ... this is a NO-GO! Now let's pretend your feeler gage had read .080" ... again with the new cam it'll close down to .060" ... this is a GO! Again, you'll have to Accurately estimate the differences between bottom of retainer ... minimum .060" OPEN, COLD.

Download of this method is available at cam sites (Crane, Comp etc) ... also in cam catalogs.

A dial indicator w/ mag base/stand can be had new for about $30 from tool distributors ... such an inexpensive/Chinese one is fine for occasional DIY user ... same gage used for checking vette rear wheel bearing, axle stubs etc.
JACK:gap

 

[Jack]

smog nazis

I am going to try and get this manifold issue resolved this weekend

Frank:
Dunno if your 79 has EGR valve or not? ... dunno if your part of TX frowns on removing smog stuff? Weiand 8004 & Performer 2101 are for NON-EGR cars. Same manifolds (but with EGR provisions) are Weiand Action Plus pn 8000 and Edelbrock Performer pn 3701. EGR intakes are about $30 more than Non-EGR.

Either intake (as long as there's not EGR issue) are legal/CARB-approved. The XE268 cam is NOT. If properly tuned, your combo should pass a sniff test.
JACK:gap

 

[sscam69]

All the emissions stuff was removed from the car by the previous owner/owners.

I don't have to worry about the sniffer test, I will pass. So I am open to a lot of options.

I took a look at the cam specs and the LSA is 110. I was hoping it was 112 so that it not sound so aggressive. Then everybody wants to take you on, like it doesn't happen already:eyerole

The only thing I have left on this car is the Cam and Heads. I have exhaust, alright intake, carb etc. The next step would be ignition then the 100shot of NOS but thats down the road as funds become available.

I am going to sell that shroud and air cleaner to free up some more money. That would give me a shot at the heads. I would go with AFR but because of funds the only ones within reach are the World Products S/R Torquers or the Sportsman II's. I would go with a 9.5 C/R

What do you think about the choice of heads?

Yeah I know those Vortec heads are good for the buck but in the end you are going to pay the same for the above mentioned heads AND the World P. heads cam with good springs already.

I am also thinking about rebuilding my Q-Jet and putting it back on. I know its a good carb, but its going to require some work especially from someone inexperienced with them like me. FYI I can't afford a new one. I have an Holley avenger 670 on top right now, the holley should be good enough for my apps.

Again, any thoughts?

 

[Jack]

budget ... what budget?

Frank:
I was under impression that $ were fairly limited to about $300.

If so ... IMHO, take that $800 - $1000 you might spend on heads & squirrel it away for pending marriage? ... family? These vettes are great but they don't compare to family bliss.

I sense a pattern emerging here. Many a motor project that began without a budget in mind resulted in too-high cost / less than desirable results.

Your L82 heads will do just fine with XE268 cam. Use of a thin (.015" - .020"), shim-steel head gasket will raise CR about .5 ... if yours has 9:1 CR with stock composite gasket (about .040" - .050") ... shim will bump it to about 9.5:1 CR.

9.5:1 CR with any IRON heads is knocking on the door of "gotta have premium 92-93 ALL the time."

On the other hand:
87-89 octane is manageable with 9.5:1 CR ALUMINUM heads. AFR is a great choice but about $1250/pair complete. Go Auto Center (Dallas TX) has Trick Flow Specialties' Aluminum heads complete w/ decent springs & 2.02-1.60 valves @ $400 each. Compare price to Jegs iron Sportsman II complete @ $398 each.

http://www.goautocenter.com/cylinder_heads.htm.

http://www.trickflow.com/product/heads/pr_heads.htm

You'll be best-served to confirm head choice & CR before you choose cam. You need to confirm deck height ... has block been decked? ... MAJOR determinant of CR. Original sbc deck height = 9.025" ... rebuilder/machinist may have record. You also need to confirm what pistons? ... original? ... flat tops? ... dished?... 2 or 4 valve reliefs? ... another MAJOR determinant of CR.
JACK:gap

 

[sscam69]

I was under impression that $ were fairly limited to about $300.

Thats what I have in my pocket right now for the cam etc. I am trying to stretch it as much as possible. If this cam deal doesn't work out I will use $150 for odds and ends. The rest just hold on to.

If so ... IMHO, take that $800 - $1000 you might spend on heads & squirrel it away for pending marriage? ... family? These vettes are great but they don't compare to family bliss.

Yeah I hear ya. I know where my priorities are. I have another $2K put away for wedding stuff. That is new money. The $300 is old money I have been saving for a LOOONNNNGG time. You know you find a penny on the floor and hold onto it. oohhh a quarter!!! That kind of saving :L I am hoping I will have a good job in about 2 months, so financialy I'll be stable. At least I hope!

QUOTE]has block been decked?[/QUOTE]
dunno? I doubt it.

what pistons? ... original? ... flat tops? ... dished?... 2 or 4 valve reliefs?

Cast replacement with 4 valve reliefs, not to sure on the CC's. Stock 441 or 442 head castings. They have been ported. True dual exhaust with headers and turbo mufflers.

The more that I think about it and after reading your post I think waiting on those heads would be a better idea. I don't want to rush things and not spec out things right and then get messed up in the end and pay double.

So the cam it is then. I will use the extra cash to buy and MSD 6AL ignition system.


Hey that "goautocenter" has some REALLY low cost items on there. Is it one of those "to good to be true" places. How is the customer service?

 

[cruzer99]

You might want to think twice about the MSD. There is nothing more frustrating than being on the road and having something go wrong with the dist and nobody has any parts. (except MSD). I think an HEI does a good job for what the average guy needs for the street and parts are available everywhere. Just my 2 c...

 

[GerryLP]

Back to manifolds

I just won an EBay auction on a Weiand X-CELerator manifold. Effective range is 2,000 RPM to about 5,600 (or even 6,000 RPM). It is single plane, but with my 2,400 stall converter I think it will work fine. Opinions?

 

[Jack]

You might want to think twice about the MSD. There is nothing more frustrating than being on the road and having something go wrong with the dist and nobody has any parts. (except MSD). I think an HEI does a good job for what the average guy needs for the street and parts are available everywhere. Just my 2 c...

;stupid well put ... ditto!

I will use the extra cash to buy and MSD 6AL ignition system.

Hey that "goautocenter" has some REALLY low cost items on there. Is it one of those "to good to be true" places. How is the customer service?

Cast replacement with 4 valve reliefs
then the 100shot of NOS

has block been decked? dunno? I doubt it.

I agree w/ cruzer82 100%! HEI is a great distributor for your combo. But unless it’s already been done ... an inexpensive recurve kit will show a lotta bang for the buck. MSD 6 box will be overkill on this combo and when it breaks you’ll wait. I like em, have em but don’t recommend one for this combo. For this combo, you’d see more improvement with a $30 curve kit (new weights, springs, vac can) than $160 up MSD box. Save yer $. If ya just gotta have one, I've got a good used MSD Nascar 6TN ... but I don't recommend any box for this combo.

Have not dealt w/ Go Center ... an acquaintance talked with them this week ... reports pricing is legit.

Cast replacement pistons with 100hp NOS:nono ... forget it ... Cast won’t take that abuse :eek for very long at all. BTW, most if not all L82 came with Forged pistons.

Block decked? :confused ... better find out before you make any further changes affecting CR ... aside from XE268 upgrade.

What I’d suggest here:
Make a plan & budget. If you haven't already, invest in a decent dial-back timing light (sears ok). Check your valve springs ... if OK then order XE268 cam & lifters, low-rise intake, gaskets and dist recurve kit. Unless both are recent, you should consider a new timing chain set / new OE-type harmonic balancer. If heads in good shape otherwise ... leave those ported-polished L82 heads right where they are. Change cam, lifters, intake in one operation. Get it broken in & running with your HEI and verify both mech & vac advance are working OK. Afterwhich install the curve kit & tune to optimal ... this should be a reliable, street-friendly but stout combo making about 325 hp @ crank. It'll sound good & feel good.
JACK:gap

 

[sscam69]

What I’d suggest here:
Make a plan & budget. If you haven't already, invest in a decent dial-back timing light (sears ok). Check your valve springs ... if OK then order XE268 cam & lifters, low-rise intake, gaskets and dist recurve kit. Unless both are recent, you should consider a new timing chain set / new OE-type harmonic balancer. If heads in good shape otherwise ... leave those ported-polished L82 heads right where they are. Change cam, lifters, intake in one operation. Get it broken in & running with your HEI and verify both mech & vac advance are working OK. Afterwhich install the curve kit & tune to optimal ... this should be a reliable, street-friendly but stout combo making about 325 hp @ crank. It'll sound good & feel good.

Sounds like a plan! Thanks for the advice!

Whats with the MSD boxes. They don't work? Overkill?

Ok I'll hold off on the NOS, I knew the pistons would not handle it for long but........well I already have future plans for a new engine. But your right I need to be able to move this thing if the need arises (i.e. city inspectors for junk vehicles:eyerole )

 

[Jack]

Whats with the MSD boxes. They don't work? Overkill?

They're an electronic device that prefers airflow & a cool-dry place to live ... cooler than under hood. They usually emit heat & a buzzing noise. Most streeters don't wanna mount in cabin. They do fail occasionally and are not locally-repairable (for most folk). They're very sensitive if bubba doesn't RTMF (read the freekin manual!) and improper wiring. They're often needed for very Hi CR motors ... but for anything else the improvement over a "good" HEI is insignificant. MSD 6 boxes are great ... I have them, I like them ... but don't recommend for your combo. We all know how any plug wire'll sting, the output from 6 box to coil is another matter ... enough to really hurt you ... about 450 volts with a bunch of amps! BTW, a regional race team who supposedly know their stuff ... they smoked FOUR 6 boxes in a row because they had wiring wrong on new $30K race truck ... so smart they didn't need to RTFM!
JACK:gap