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Re: Overpopulation

ZR100060 said:
I have a 91 ZR1 (00060) that will run in the high 12s, I also have a 500 + HP Pantera that will run in the low 11s. The rice rockets don't seem interested in the Z, but I can't drive anywhere without Mustangs and Camaros on the bumper of the Pantera. It drives me nuts. What really sets me off is being on a super crowded southern California freeway rolling along at 28 mph because of the traffic. It almost makes you think of selling your car. Too many people-too many cars-too many idiots!!

Interesting....I own a '90 ZR-1 and I've experienced the complete opposite. Rice rockets are always wanting to race. They're like....gnats that just won't go away. But low and behold....every now and then....the ole fly swatter just happens to catch one in mid-flight and........WAP ....no more gnat. :D :D
 
I know it's a cruel thing to do, but I took the ZR1 emblem off my rear bumper and just show them my big red ass every chance I get.
 
vettl83 said:
I know it's a cruel thing to do, but I took the ZR1 emblem off my rear bumper and just show them my big red ass every chance I get.

ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!! :L :L :L
 
I guess those ricers just don't know that your ZR1 isn't a "normal" Vette'!:r
 
It's kind of interesting that this topic has come up recently. Just this weekend, I watched one of my favorite car movies....Fast and Furious.

Now before everyone gets upset and :puke you have to admit, it is a good car movie that gets your adrenaline pumping.

Regardless of the fact that they look....yucky.....and they sound like......the blender sitting on my kitchen counter, and those coffee cans hanging out from underneath the rear bumper are.....gross....you've got to admit....some of these suckers move and they are worthy of some respect.

Also.....compare the days '50s and '60s when kids were into hopping up their Chevy's and Pontiacs and Dodges? Now think back to the late 70s and early 80s. Kids really didn't pay much attention to hot rodding cars...at least not in my experiences anyway.

It some ways, it was kind of disheartening. You still see it today in various ways. Most kids don't even bat an eyelash at a midyear Corvette that goes driving by. Today, it's all about computers and video games. However, the one the growing trend is modding imports.

It's not what you or I care to do, but you know something....in a way, I'm glad. Because it's a sign that some kids are still born today with fuel running through their veins even though their ride of choice is something you or I wouldn't get caught dead in.

So....while they can be annoying, and they sound horrible and look like hell....they do deserve a little respect. And of course, as the saying goes....walk softly, but carry a big.....fly swatter. ;) ;) :SLAP
 
Point well taken

Yeah, there are sure a lot of worse things those kids could be doing out there besides souping up those econoboxes. They could be out there dealing drugs or other illegal things.
 
Before I forget

My favorite car movie is Gone In 60 Seconds!

Not really a car movie, but that C3 convertible that Chris Tucker drove in the Rush Hour movies was definitely bada$$.
 
I really don't think they know one Vette from another, but it does help to pickup a little extra cash from the late model Mustang, Camaro, and Firebird guys. Besides you can always put your emblem back on for shows and Corvette gatherings. However on a more serious note I believe TPIS has some nice packages for L98, LT1, and LT4 motors that are tried and proven. Visit their website at www.tpis.com they will be more than happy to assist you with any tech questions you have.
 
Guess I am getting old....but I think there has to be more to life then to worry about getting beat at a light buy a young kid with a mustang his daddy bought for him.
I am surprised at some of the reply's here. For me, I would rather find things that would make my car run better and go farther on a tank of gas, then to waste it in a testosterone shootout with a "ricer". Gas prices are increasing, so is insurance because of folks driving recklessly on the street. Not a week goes by that the news reports some kid getting killed drag racing on the street. Is this the legacy we want to leave folks with? I prefer the old adage...better to keep your mouth shut and let folks think you are a fool then open it and remove all doubt. Apply that to driving my beautiful corvette I slaved many years to get...I could care less about a mustang beating me at a light, I know I can whip him, but what does it prove? Not a damn thing. I just smile at the next light....and cherish the thought that he will never know, let him think what he wants to...
 
All this talk about ricers and turbos....What about me?:eyerole :L I enjoy every moment I spend on Boost. :L And I'm not a ricer. Nice 3" exhaust keeps things pretty quiet on a V-6 too. :L As much as I love my '81, I'm still disappointed in the performance. Sure, I could have modded it out, but for someone in my position, it's easier to get a car that's already performance oriented rather than spending money and time trying to make one. And having AWD in Colorado is definately a plus. :D

I think we should all respect fine automotive engineering for what it is, whether it's carbs, efi, turbos, whatever. Just be glad the auto world is continually increasing hp output instead of shrinking it like the late 70s early 80s. Don't you agree, no matter the car, ricer or whatever, I enjoy reading about ever increasing Hp.

Look out, you might see a fuel shortage and tighter emissions push your next Z06 back to the performance #'s of my '81. :L

T Jay
 
A few random thoughts

I love big (heavy) American V8s and will pay whatever it takes to fuel the beasts.
If a respected company produced a dyno/track tested performance package which was streetable for 1k to $3000, i'd go for it.
I grew up working on the small block chevy and have four of them.
I have more fun at the nastalgia races than the import races; the crowd is alot more fun and safe.
Any Corvette is more cool looking than any Japanese car.
Lots of leg room in my vette, I'm 6'1".
People ask me all the time if my '96 is new or if it is a kit car???
I rarely get challenged to a race.
I'm keeping my '96 and may just buy a '69 with a BIG block that burns even more fuel.
Chrome bumpers and 450 hp would do more for me than new tech stuff.
I'm a GM loyalist.
Do ricers throw the wave? vette pilots do!
Chris N:w
 
A few random thoughts

Amen Chris and may the horse power be with you. 91 ZR1 Red/Saddle #2039 PS: msdout165 the new Z06 at 405 hp does put out less emissions than your 81.
 
Eagle85C4 said:
I am surprised at some of the reply's here. For me, I would rather find things that would make my car run better and go farther on a tank of gas, then to waste it in a testosterone shootout with a "ricer". ? I prefer the old adage...better to keep your mouth shut and let folks think you are a fool then open it and remove all doubt.


Street racing is dangerous and illegal. It is like gambling. Everybody gambles in one form or another, but not everybody will actually hit the slots at Las Vegas as they have some degree of moral or ethical issues with a casino. That same person may play the lottery, or take a chance on not buying life insurance which is also a form of gambling, just not illegal. Heck, you might have even exceeded the speed limit once or twice over the years.

No doubt I have turned down way more street races than I have ever taken on. I have to tell you though, some of the best times I have had behind the wheel have been those unplanned, unpredictable moments of pulling up to a redlight wheel to wheel with some other performance car, or better yet, a driver that thinks he has a performance car and squaring off when the light goes green. It is like the old west days with a shoot out at high noon, and baby, there is a new sheriff in town! (at least when I get the big block 69 on the road!)

To be 100% honest with you, I will not challenge a car that I know has the capacity to rub my nose in the dirt. Who wants to do that? In fact, I rarely challenge anybody, trouble usually follows me, and I can't resist a good race when all the other elements are in line.


Now, we have a group of hot rodders here with some seriously cool old detroit muscle. On Saturday nights they meet at the Steak & Shake and wait till midnight. Then they cruise to a specific spot and illegal street race as long as they can until the police show up. I do not participate in this, and we clear out and go home when this crowd shows up. They square off, ricer vs. camaro and go at it all night long. Come Monday, the local speed shops and economy get the benefit of these challenges as everybody goes looking for that extra edge, more NOS, or whatever they need to be the fastest the following Saturday.

I will share something very interesting with you. I have been handling automobile accidents in my professional career for almost ten years now. In those ten years I have seen thousands of car crashes, and cleaned up the mess they leave behind. Of the thousands I have handled, not ONE has been the result of street racing. I handle fatalities, serious injury, and law suits, and or any situation where somebody complains of injury. That is of course what concerns you...right? I would say based upon my personal statistics that this is not as serious an issue as the many a moment you have each time you are on the highway and glance down to dial your radio station, talk on the cell phone, or pick something up off the floor and BAM, you just crashed into somebody.

I realize many folks own vettes simply because they like the way they look, sound, and feel. Eagle84C4, you are not the first person like that I have met. That is cool. I would love to be the second owner of a car you have owned, because you are the kind of fellow that won't squeeze all the life out of it first. We all have different interest in the hobby, I would just appreciate you not calling me a fool on this open forum because we don't see eye to eye on all issues of our sport. You are more than welcome to think it all you want, but I suggest you follow you own advice and keep those things to yourself so that others don't form the same opinions about you.

Now, back on topic! I agree TPIS has some great mods, but I don't see a consistant use of those in the masses. The G.M. crate motors are great, but won't run worth poop unless they have the correct fuel/spark delivery. That is where people mess up and end up with a ZZ crate motor that does not put 200 hsp on the ground.

For me, the miniram is the best thing I have seen available to do to the L98. On LT1 engines, better gears and reprogramed E-prom seem to do the trick. However, these are not extreme mods, and don't see extreme results. There has to be a better way/combo with less guess work. The imports are only going to get faster as we see here from some of the replys. That more or less means that our cars are basically getting slower without even trying (except the ZR1 and Callaway).
 
Rrubel

Sure WRX owner race their cars, they spend time at the track to, never said they did not. What I am saying is the degree of issues they come up with compared to an engine than does not NEED to rev high or get boosted to produce power. I have seen many a WRX at Raceway Park and never have I witnessed them running as consistently or fast as the average Corvette. Remember that at 100 mph ever 10th is close to 15 feet, and a 14.6 is pretty far behind a 14 flat. Its head gasket city on a new car. I wonder how long the dealer is going keep changing them free of charge. And as for rally cross- the WRX claims to be fast in straight line so its competition for the Corvette, does the Vette claim to be an off road car? And as for handling, well you have to go back to the early 80s to find a Vette that cant tackle the WRX in that arena.

As for what engine is better? Be real, the LT1, LS1 does not need to rev to 7500 to produce power, a pushrod V8 that puts out over 250 hp at 1700 rpm with no fancy overhead cams or turbos and still gets close to 30 mpg, and passes emissions and your saying that’s obsolete?

My lawn mower can rev to 8000rpm, does that make it better?

And last, you stated there was no support for GM products, that’s its obsoleted by the new kids on the block- well my used 95 C4 ran me 17 grand, plus 850 for the mods, would you even consider buying a 7 year old ricer to soup up? And I don’t think Subaru is giving those WRXs away, last issue of Motor Trend reports an as tested price of the mid to high 20s. The after market is so large for GM cars there is almost nothing that is not available.

Basically I am not saying the WRX is a bad car, its just no comparison to a Vette of similar price (new WRX Vs used Vette) If you apply enough money to any car it can go fast, “speed costs money how fast do you want to go?” was a sign hanging in the shop I used to work in, but the WRX is still a passable looking car at best, with a limited life span. On and speaking of obsolete, in 1964 Ford (not a Ford fan but) ran a bunch of Comets (sodium filled valves, small displacement engines at high revs) on a track for 100 miles at 100 mph. Try that with a WRX. How long does a 200watt light bulb last?
 
No one will disagree that street racing is illegal and dangerous. I certainly don't disagree with that notion. I don't ever go about looking for races, but I certainly wouldn't back down from one in certain situations. I think all of us in here are old and wise enough to know when to race and when not to.

Now the L98 engine is known for its torque that comes in early. So the only problem would be getting power at the higher end right?

Guys, look at the WRX commercial. They tout that vehicle as an off-road vehicle. It's really a rally car! Corvette is a street sports car. 2 totally different animals, but potentially fierce competitors in a street race.

I'll give you guys a line that a guy told me a couple of years ago in regards to physical fighting:

"I've never lost a fight in my life and I've never started a fight in my life."
 
Good stuff.

You know, I love to watch the World Ralley Cup races. That is EXTREME. I also found out that the engines and drive train on the Ralley cars (at least the top performers) does not share much if anything with the street car version. The last show I watched had a Hyundai running well ahead of the pack at one point, then it blew the motor. The spokes person for team Hyundai explained that the engine cost them around $42,000 !!!

That is also comparable to the Race LS1. You know that the engine the C5 R is NOTHING like the street version. In fact, you would have a hard time driving it on the street, much less going more than 10,000 miles without needed a rebuild.

I for one am very impressed with the overall performance of the imports right now. Yes it takes a ton of money to get there, but they are doing it, and doing it very well.

The non-modified L98 engine can't compete in overall competition with these high reving monsters.
 
mxdout165 the new Z06 at 405 hp does put out less emissions than your 81.

I know. :D That's the beauty of new technology. I was just trying to make a point. The beauty of new technology is that with cars like the Z06, etc, they no longer have to choke the life out of them to pass emissions standards like they did in the late 70s early 80s. They continue to make more power and less emissions at the same time, which is amazing! But back to the topic at hand, trying to compare a high tech, boosted engine like the WRX has to a General Motors V8 doesn't make much sense to me. This topic is much the same as the Viper vs. Vette topic a while back. I think we should respect each car for what it is, a feat of automotive engineering, but it wouldn't hurt my feelings knowing every Vette on the road could eat one for dinner. :D

T Jay
 
We're comparing 2 different things

It would be like comparing Arnold Schwarzenegger's theory on fitness to Bruce Lee's theory on fitness. The conversation's would be endless, but nonetheless, they're both extraordinary feats of fitness. Just like the WRX and Corvette.
 
warren s said:
Rrubel

And last, you stated there was no support for GM products, that’s its obsoleted by the new kids on the block- well my used 95 C4 ran me 17 grand, plus 850 for the mods, would you even consider buying a 7 year old ricer to soup up? And I don’t think Subaru is giving those WRXs away, last issue of Motor Trend reports an as tested price of the mid to high 20s. The after market is so large for GM cars there is almost nothing that is not available.

(not a Ford fan but) ran a bunch of Comets (sodium filled valves, small displacement engines at high revs) on a track for 100 miles at 100 mph. Try that with a WRX. How long does a 200watt light bulb last?

How about 100,000 miles at 100+ mph? Subaru did that with a production GT-B wagon (Legacy model with similar engine to WRX that we should get within the next year or so as the new GT). Or 167+ mph for the measured mile with an essentially stock engine. Oh, they last...

Would I consider buying a 7-year old racer to soup up? Sure. I bought a 16-year old Corvette to race and sold my 13-year-old RX to someone who's going to rally it.

WRX new costs $23k. Bargain of the century. And don't even start on aftermarket parts availability - that's part of what started this thread in the first place. Rice has a HUGE aftermarket worldwide. GM's is pretty much confined to North America.

Are the large pushrod V8's obsolete? Yes. There's only so far you can push them to continue meeting gov't regulations. Why do you think auto manufacturers have moved away from them in the first place?
[RICHR]
 
:D Yeah, I don't think GM sells to many Cavaliers in Japan.:D
 

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