Bowtie Overdrive 2004R

[Red69]

Thanks Art, It seems 'bracket racing' was the buzz word that automatically dictated their level 3 recommendetion.

What stall TC are you using?

 

[Art Jett]

I'm going with a 2200 stall. It was recommended by a number of people. The car is still in a million pieces at the moment, so I don't know how it will act. BTW I have 3.08 rears. I bought the Bowtie shifter mod kit and it went together real easy. The short block should be here late this week and the fuel injection system and the transmission should arrive in a week or so. I'm getting antsy. I've had the car for 4 years and only started on it last Dec. Maybe by the end of the year I'll have it together and painted. OH BOY!!!

 

[Red69]

Thanks Art, sounds like you have your project well planned. Good luck on your final assembly.

 

[Glensgages]

Red 69:


..... looks-like you've found some informative guys to help with your A/OD install.....
many of the guys here can point you in the correct direction, and might be a bit-more 'friendlier' than that 'other' site.


Sorry I couldn't help you any-more with your 700-R4/200-4r questions.....

 

[Red69]

Red 69:


..... looks-like you've found some informative guys to help with your A/OD install.....
many of the guys here can point you in the correct direction, and might be a bit-more 'friendlier' than that 'other' site.

Yup...ya always seem to get better answers when everyone parks their ego.


Sorry I couldn't help you any-more with your 700-R4/200-4r questions.....

Glen, you are helpful by admitting your limitation and suggesting alternative sources. Seek and ye shall find!

 

[Glensgages]

..... you are helpful by admitting your limitation.....

[Inspector #2211 Harry Callahan, "Magnum Force" ]
"..... a man's GOTTA-know his own-limitations....."
[/Inspector #2211 Harry Callahan, "Magnum Force" ]

 

[Art Jett]

Red 69:


..... looks-like you've found some informative guys to help with your A/OD install.....
many of the guys here can point you in the correct direction, and might be a bit-more 'friendlier' than that 'other' site.


I just downloaded the instructions for installing my 700R-4 and I have a feeling I may be asking for help too! There are 20 pages and they say about 20 times that if they aren't followed exactly that the transmission will burn up and they won't warranty it. It's a little intimidating to say the least! :eek

 

[Glensgages]

I just downloaded the instructions for installing my 700R-4 and I have a feeling I may be asking for help too! There are 20 pages and they say about 20 times that if they aren't followed exactly that the transmission will burn up and they won't warranty it. It's a little intimidating to say the least! :eek

I told Red 69 when we started speaking that I had no 'real' hands-on knowledge of these A/OD aftermerket transmission (I do some bracket-racing with THM400s ), but it sure sounds-like BTO is very-strict about how you install their products, giving themselves plenty of lee-way to say "I-told-you-so" and walk-away if something goes-wrong.....
:ugh

 

[Art Jett]

Boy that's no kidding!

 

[Evolution1980]

I told Red 69 when we started speaking that I had no 'real' hands-on knowledge of these A/OD aftermerket transmission (I do some bracket-racing with THM400s ), but it sure sounds-like BTO is very-strict about how you install their products, giving themselves plenty of lee-way to say "I-told-you-so" and walk-away if something goes-wrong.....
:ugh

Art,
It's strange, they seem to be strict about it, but then when I tried to follow up with them, I got ZERO support from them. However, the base 700R4 pressures are about the same, regardless of the build (as far as I know). You can find these 'base' pressures listed at other sites online. As long as your pressures are within a few percent, your trans is fine. (I'm a little salty towards BTO for their 'post purchase' customer support/satisfaction.) But again, as long as the pressures are in line with what is expected, you shouldn't have any problems.
(You'll likely expire the "year" warranty before the "12,000 mile" part of it. I only do about 3K miles per year, and that's in the span of about 4-5 months. Sooo...in my case, the warranty period was somewhat irrelavent.)

PS - doing a conversion to a 700R4 is NOT an easy task for a DIY'er. To do it correctly is NOT a 5 hour job or really even a "one weekend" job. Unless of course my install was very abnormal, which I don't think it was...

If you need some assistance or pics, I may be able to supply you some.

 

[Art Jett]

They kept mentioning removing the pan to make adjustments. How many times did you have to do this? It is not an easy task unless one has a lift! Also, they have a section on the lock-up wiring. I understood from the sales info that the wiring was supposed to be complete inside the pan and all that was required of the customer was to do the external wiring? It is going to be a real PITA to break everything in as I have a new motor and transmission. Oh well, it's all fun and games, right?

 

[Evolution1980]

They kept mentioning removing the pan to make adjustments. How many times did you have to do this? It is not an easy task unless one has a lift! Also, they have a section on the lock-up wiring. I understood from the sales info that the wiring was supposed to be complete inside the pan and all that was required of the customer was to do the external wiring? It is going to be a real PITA to break everything in as I have a new motor and transmission. Oh well, it's all fun and games, right?

The only wiring that I'm aware is INSIDE the pan is the wiring for the lock up solenoid. Everything else should be external. I don't know what you'd need to be doing inside the pan...??? Maybe the instructions are slightly different for the older C3's, but I doubt it. The transmission itself doesn't change, so.... ???
As for getting the car up, I had it up on 4 or 6 jackstands as high as they would go. Gotta have room to manuever all that stuff under there as well as support it and the engine while you are mating everything up. Like I said, it's not an easy job for a DIY'er. And it is not possible to accomplish as one-man team. An engine swap is a piece of cake compared to doing this conversion. The difficulty factor in this job really makes the 'plug & play' 200R4 seem a really attractive alternative. :L

 

[Glensgages]

..... I'm a little salty towards BTO for their 'post purchase' customer support/satisfaction.....

I hope to swap a THM400 into my '82 in the next few weeks/months, and I understand the 700-R4 cross-member needs to be changed as-well:
although I've been told the BTO cross-member makes this job easier (? ), but based-on stories I've heard on-line about them (even from people who LIKE their products ), I'm thinking of avoiding them all-together, and I guess we'll just kit-bash one together from an earlier C3.....

 

[Art Jett]

I have the one that came out of my 77 with a TH350 that I'm not going to use. If you can use it I would be willing to part with it. I wish I would have known you were going to do the switch earlier. I bought a crossmember from an 82 w/ a 700R-4 for my installation. If you are interested, PM me and we can work out a deal for the piece and shipping to your location. I'm not sure if the crossmembers are the same for a 350 and a 400, but someone else here will know.

 

[Evolution1980]

I've heard on-line about them (even from people who LIKE their products )

That's me, that's me! (...unfortunately...)

 

[GerryLP]

.... I believe that BTO requires the inline filter for the first 500 miles (which is just a good idea, requried or not)...

Evo (Master-Blender-Colonel-Sir),

That does make it a very strict requirement. I would hate to have to cut the cooling line and add a filter. Specially so, since there is a CRC product made to flush the transmission lines and radiator's transmission channel. Works great and it prevents the accumulated metal shavings and residue from reaching the thrust bearing on the converter (after flushing the system).

I placed a strong magnet in the oil pan to prevent spreading metal shavings around the system in betwen fluid changes.

GerryLP:cool

 

[Glensgages]

I have the one that came out of my 77 with a TH350 that I'm not going to use. If you can use it I would be willing to part with it. I wish I would have known you were going to do the switch earlier. I bought a crossmember from an 82 w/ a 700R-4 for my installation. If you are interested, PM me and we can work out a deal for the piece and shipping to your location. I'm not sure if the crossmembers are the same for a 350 and a 400, but someone else here will know.

That brings-up another question that I have:
are cross-members from the earlier, THM350/TM400 equipped C3s interchangeable with latter 700-R4 cars (i.e. - are the frames the same, that they will physically 'fit', or does THAT even have to be modified )?

I'm fairly-new to C3s (although I've had this one for 6+ years, I've done NOTHING to it in the ways of modifying it ), and I'm not-sure what is the same from model-year to model-year (i.e. - 'original' THMs, lock-up THMs, A/OD w/lock-up..... different rear-ends pre-'79 and after '80, etc. ):
these cars sure-aren't Camaros, Chevelles, or Novas.....
:crazy

Thanks for the offer, Art..... as I get knee-deep in this project, I'll be in-touch if I need that cross-member!

That's me, that's me! (...unfortunately...)

Unfortunately, you ain't the only-one, Evo.....
:nono


As we discussed recently, I'm trying to build an ultra-consistent, bullet-proof 12-second bracket car, and while it'd be 'nice' to keep it street-driven (I do have a truck and trailer to tow to/from the strip ), for the cost of building an indestructable A/OD & high-stall converter, and then having to worry-about a vendor standing behind their products, I'll stick with what I've run for years in my Z28:
I have a pair of THM400s that my local transmission-guy rebuilds for me for $300 that I can't seem to hurt (the spare has never been in the car yet, after 4 grueling seasons of weekly-racing!!!!! ), and if it is faulty, he takes care of it A.S.A.P., no-questions-asked, and I have a pair of matching 8"/4500-stall converters that last-and-last.....

I 'met' Red 69 on 'another-Forum', and he is interested in building a similar-type car, but he must drive his, so an A/OD is imperative for his needs:
I did-not want to steer him wrong, or deter him from an A-OD trans, which is why I sorta 'pointed-him' in this direction in the first-place.



I'd like to thank this Forum's membership for helping-out Red 69, a guy who wants to do with his Corvette what it was intended to do:
RACE!!!!!

 

[Evolution1980]

I placed a strong magnet in the oil pan to prevent spreading metal shavings around the system in betwen fluid changes.

That's a good idea. Better than the magnetized plug by itself. I'll probably disassemble an old computer harddrive and grab the 'rare earth' magnet out of it. Them puppies are strong! Maybe one on the oil pan and bottom of the oil filter too! :L

(Master-Blender-Colonel-Sir) ...

 

[Evolution1980]

That brings-up another question that I have:
are cross-members from the earlier, THM350/TM400 equipped C3s interchangeable with latter 700-R4 cars (i.e. - are the frames the same, that they will physically 'fit', or does THAT even have to be modified )?

Nope, they are NOT interchangeable.
200R4, existing crossmember is OK.
700R4 requires custom crossmember due to longer tailshaft / mounting point on the trans. At that, I believe the custom crossmembers between model years is going to vary. How do I know? Because BTO charged me for 2 defective ones (AND the overnight shipping!) and have never refunded me for any of it.... (that's where my comment about "zero post-sale customer service" came from, in addition to other things...) Anyways, on one of the crossmembers they sent me, it had 1979 written on it, so that's what I'm basing my educated guess...

 

[Glensgages]

Nope, they are NOT interchangeable.
200R4, existing crossmember is OK.
700R4 requires custom crossmember due to longer tailshaft / mounting point on the trans...

I probably wasn't clear-enough on my earlier post:
ad

is a cross-member for a THM350 in a 1977-chassis, as Art says he has, compatible with a THM400 in an '82-chassis (i.e. - a straight-across swap ), or will the cross-member need to be modifed to fit the chassis ?
:confused