Smooth air "coupler" installed today and a question

[Toms007]

So glad to see you back CorvetteDude95. I hope that you find that not all people are like your first experience. You must remember that even good people have bad days, and some people just don't come across well in writing. And then some are just as they appear and there's no changing, not to say we have any of those here...... Catbert is right, these are all opinions and we know about opinions, right?

 

[TedC]

Welcome back!!! I'm no Corvette expert. My knowledge is gained through hands on experiences, reading books/manuals, searching the internet, talking to factory trained techs, and getting pointers from those on this forum. Yes, you will find some comments very opinionated, but overall, I've found this forum of great value in my ability to maintain an older Vette. Save the wave.

 

[catbert]

Corvettedude95

Plan on joining us in Bowling Green in June for the CAC members CruiseFestivus - for the Restofus. Details in November, if I'm on the ball - December if I'm not. Join us for the Corvette museum, factory tours (if available), cruises, minor league baseball, bench racing and lies about dyno HP - and a few beers.

 

[1963SS]

and a few beers

Beer? Did Catbert say beer? I'm so there. Corvettedude, where 'bouts in Kentucky are you? I live near Ashland, right near the West Virginia state line. I was born and bred in Martin County. I'm always up for a road trip. Let's have a beer and I'll show you that not all forum members are BUTTHEADS. First round's on me....the second too.

I know all about light wallets also but I've been lucky enough to build some engines and make a buck or two on the side since I retired. I read that you're a disabled Vet. Sorry to hear that. I've been shot 3 times and blown up by a "Bouncing Betty" once. That's enough for me. My son's out driving my 95 Vette so I can't go look at the wire you're talking about. If no one's answered by this evening I promise to go take a look and let you know. What color are the wires?

 

[Hib Halverson]

I, too, was glad to read that "Corvettedude95" re-evaluated his decision and remains a member of the CAC.

In a perfect world, all CAC members would be shiny, happy people who subscribe to the "Rodney King attitude"....Can't we all just get along?

News flash: The CAC is far from a perfect world.

"aklim" knows his stuff–well, most of the time he does:L–but, like myself, sometimes can have a pretty acidic view of how we sometimes go about modifying our cars. At times, he chooses sarcasm to make his point. Maybe he forgot that not all the folks appreciate sarcasm the same way. In any event, I think it unlikely, "aklim" meant to offend anyone.
As for "airfoils" or, more properly, throttle body inlet fairings, first there was this....

Congratulations on your new airfoil and smooth coupler. If you need a few extra CFM then that is the way to go. Since the stock 48mm flows so well there isn't much need to go bigger until you're up to about 450 FWHP or so. GM Performance used the 48mm TB on the 502 making over 500 HP. It should work for many small blocks. The smooth coupler should aid also. It's a laminar flow thing. If being smooth didn't help there would be no need to grind flashing and casting marks out of intakes and heads. Here is a chart from a dis-interested third party that shows the actual airflow of some TB's and airfoils. All you naysayers....read it and weep. The proof's in the pudding. The airfoil adds about 50 CFM to the TB's. If you're at the upper limit of your throttle body and need a little more it's cheaper than going to a bigger TB.

Also remember that the stock MAF can only flow around 725 or so if it's de-screened. That is the limiting factor, not the throttle body itself. IMHO. ---Gunny---

Followed by this....

The crow eating line forms at the left

GREAT job on the flow numbers. It illustrates clearly that 1.) S.O.T.P. is sometimes a good gauge, and 2.) not everyone that opines loudly knows what the hell they are talking about.

Now, let's step out of this reality distortion field surrounding the airfoil discussion and look at some facts.

First, there's no question that when, tested solely for airflow, one of those fairings is going to improve flow once you approach the throttle body's flow limit.

But....if you do the math with the airflow numbers "1963SS" posted, the changes were 5% and 6% respectively, changes so small, if you ran them in a real world situation...like, on a car on a chassis dyno...the difference in performance would be small at best.

Let's also remember that the original discussion was about a stock or near stock LT1. It is unlikely that, even at peak power, an engine like that is going to be flowing 780 cfm. It's going to be flowing less. As the fairing's effect will by significantly less as flow decreases, the effect on performance will be less on a stock or near stock engine.

So, once, again we're back to the point I've been making for over 20 years in discussions about adding "airfoils" to stock throttle bodies....they make little or no contribution to a stock or near stock engine's performance, but once the engine is modified such that the airflow across it is significantly more than stock and near the TB's maximum capacity, then they become useful.

As for smooth bore couplers...the same is true, ie: little or no improvement on a stock engine but a modest improvement to an engine which is modified to the point that the coupler has become a restriction.

Oh....and "Catbert"....about the crow you got sizzling on the barbie...all yours, pal.

 

[Corvettedude95]

Thank you...

For all the "Welcome backs" and the follow up notes.

HIB, Thanks for the news flash, and again, I didn't make a claim as it being the greatest thing, I wasn't asking if it would make the front wheels come off the ground. I was simply making a nice gesture about, more than likely, the cheapest "mod" anyone could put on their car. That's it. That's all I was doing. Most folks probably read it and moved right along. Others probably laughed and moved right along. Believe me, I WILL definitely make my posts and questions crystal clear before I post about a mod/part I'm thinking of adding.

I understand that it's hard to truly express yourself on the internet, but there is the time when you KNOW when someone is being a total pr!#k. The comment about me stimulating the economy...was no joke. I responded (not like I wanted to) in kind and moved on. Well, I'm back, now I know that guys attitude; to an extent. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'll just respond to how I'm talked to. I will stay within the rules and guidelines of the site of course. He!!, I have a wonderful sense of humor (you wouldn't have guessed that after I got my boxers in a bunch huh) and like to laugh whenever possible. (for example, I added a "signature line" like he suggested)

BUT, if I make a joke, I will accompany it with one of those smiley thingies to make sure the member knows I was joking/kidding/trying to lighten his/her day.

Anyway, I'm over this part of the "problem". Like Tom said, we all have our good days and bad days (I was having mine the day I read it, I was waiting to see if I had Throat Cancer) and "we" can move along now.

@Tom, you are right, I guess no matter what age a person is, he can learn and I'm always willing to learn.

@Catbert, point well taken and I'll even take it with a little Texas Pete and Pepper.


@GUNNY, I'm currently living in Hubert NC, right down the street from Camp LeJeune. I was born and bred in Louisville and I know that there are events in Bowling Green and that's why I said that I hope to meet some of you guys/gals at one of the events; one day. I appreciate the offer to come and look at the wire (it's grey and "plugs" into the rear air coupler) and once I move back home, we'll definitely get together for those beers. My mom lives in Nicholasville, so you're not that far away that we can't make it happen.

@Muddywaters, what exhaust are you running? I currently have the stock exhaust; I assume. I have black, round cylinder like mufflers on the car and I didn't notice any difference in the exhaust note. (I'm thinking about FlowMasters in the near future)

@Ted, funny you should say that about the manuals. One of my neighbors came over Sunday and left to repair manuals with my wife. He said that he had a Corvette, but his wife got it in the divorce and he got the manuals. They are pretty hefty, so I have some reading to do.

@John, since you mentioned the Cruise Control, I recently found out mine does not work. Do I have to replace the whole lever? Or should is there another problem area? Everything else on turn signal lever works. What do you mean by "took the resonator out"?

I must also correct the site (company) that I buy my "stuff" from, it's MID AMERICA MOTORWORKS. Not the cluster I tried to type last night. :L

Again, Thank you all for the "welcome backs"!

 

[catbert]

Oh....and "Catbert"....about the crow you got sizzling on the barbie...all yours, pal.

How's that? The only objective figures (as opposed to WAGs, rants and sermons) in the whole discussion support the "opinion" that, so some extent, the little add-ons add something to the mix.

The crows getting cold.

 

[muddywaters]

CD95, I have muffler eliminator pipes on my 88.

 

[ernestD]

I worked for G.M. for 30 years-so remember this-the corvette is a well put together-the eng.who made it happen know all the tricks,but they only do so much.tweeking can always be done,some gains and some not so much.some claims are bull.WE all know=want to go real fast?spend big money-but if you find a little trick that works share it,we are all vette lovers here.Some members are very smart about corvettes,some are new to this-be helpfull.

 

[1963SS]

GUNNY, I'm currently living in Hubert NC, right down the street from Camp LeJeune

Well, heck, you can run, but ya' can't hide in my old stomping grounds. I'll be at my beach house in Ocean Isle, NC in a couple of weeks. That's only about a hundred miles or so from Lejeune.:L Time for that beer!!

 

[1963SS]

they make little or no contribution to a stock or near stock engine's performance, but once the engine is modified such that the airflow across it is significantly more than stock and near the TB's maximum capacity, then they become useful.

I've read many posts by Hib and I will say that he's one of the better informed individuals on the internet. His wording is exemplary and rarely leaves room for doubt. Hib, you, and only you, may step out of the crow eating chow line. Nearly every reference to these airfoils say that they are just "worthless" and a "waste of money". There is rarely a reference to an RPM or a horsepower level. I totally agree that if a vehicle only needs 500 CFM then adding the capability for an additional 5 or 6 percent beyond 700 is not needed. However that 5 or six percent can be a cost saver for someone approaching the limits of their components. It can be significant. I'd love to get 6% better return on my retirement savings, or 6% more horsepower.

Most engines that I deal with are in the 450-500+ HP range so I utilize numbers like 600-800 CFM and understand the limitations of undersized intake components.

Many people have perceived a difference by utilizing the throttle body airfoils or "throttle body inlet fairings". It is one of the most popular mods for first time owners and any perceived difference may well be the Placebo effect. About ten years ago Horsepower TV did a test on an Impala SS and found out that with the airfoil it made 210 RWHP and without it it made.......wait for it......210 RWHP. Although I wouldn't use one on a stock engine, many have with perceived success. Who am I to burst their bubble?

Well, this has been fun but I've got a busy day. I've got to adjust the gas line magnet on my Impala and install a Tornado (intake turbulator) on the Vette because my engine ionizer seems to be malfunctioning. I'll keep you posted.

 

[John Robinson]

Come on people stop . Give it a rest your all winners in your own mind. Crow ain't half bad with the right . So lets be and move on to the next helpfull debate.

 

[1963SS]

Awww John, we're just playin'. There's been no hurtful things said in quite a while and this is now a friendly discussion. Just think, down the road when someone needs to know about this, they'll Google it and bring this thread up. Everything you need to know is here. That's kinda cool. Sometimes these are called "Internet Discussion Boards" for a reason. You are correct though, most of it's already been said. Now it's just the clean up.

 

[John Robinson]

Awww John, we're just playin'. There's been no hurtful things said in quite a while and this is now a friendly discussion. Just think, down the road when someone needs to know about this, they'll Google it and bring this thread up. Everything you need to know is here. That's kinda cool. Sometimes these are called "Internet Discussion Boards" for a reason. You are correct though, most of it's already been said. Now it's just the clean up.

It's beginning to look better now

 

[Hib Halverson]

Come on people stop . Give it a rest your all winners in your own mind. Crow ain't half bad with the right . So lets be and move on to the next helpfull debate.

Ok.
I vote for a Seafoam thread.

 

[John Robinson]

Ok.
I vote for a Seafoam thread.

Thats a good one. My favorite that I have not seen here is sawdust in the differentil to quite it down. And what ever happened to STP in The engine were did it go?

 

[Hib Halverson]

For all the "Welcome backs" and the follow up notes.

HIB, Thanks for the news flash, and again, I didn't make a claim as it being the greatest thing, I wasn't asking if it would make the front wheels come off the ground. I was simply making a nice gesture about, more than likely, the cheapest "mod" anyone could put on their car. That's it. That's all I was doing. Most folks probably read it and moved right along. Others probably laughed and moved right along. Believe me, I WILL definitely make my posts and questions crystal clear before I post about a mod/part I'm thinking of adding.

(snip)

I usually advise people not to look for the "cheapest mod".

More often than not, the "cheapest mod" ends up being quite expensive because it has no value, ie: if a 50 dollar fairing netted 2 hp on a stock engine that would be very expensive.

As for highly modified engines and those fairings....once you get to the point that you're making 25-30% more power than stock, if the TB is documented to be the restriction, I'd go to a TB with larger bores before I'd stick one of those fairings on it, but....I digress.

Let's talk about Seafoam.

 

[muddywaters]

Ok, Who has the best time in the 1/4 mile with 3 inches of snow or more on the track???

 

[BigJimZ16]

Ok, Who has the best time in the 1/4 mile with 3 inches of snow or more on the track???

Chains, studded, or non-studded snow tires?? :L

 

[catbert]

Ok.
I vote for a Seafoam thread.

THAT would be awesome!