Question: Upgrading my Roller rocker arms

[Marv02]

I am planning to replace my Cheep China Brand Full Roller Rocker arm with a set of Comp Cams Ultra Magnum Steel arms.
I have read so many bad stories about the cheep RRA failing.
If I going to upgrade should I go with 1.6 Rocker arm on Intake only and keep 1.5 on the Exhaust.
Or go with
1.65 In & 1.55 Ex,
1.65 In & 1.5 Ex
Or 1.6 on both, 1.65 on both In & Ex
I running a mild Hyd Flat tappet single pattern can with .447/.447 Lift 214/214@50 290/290 110 C/L 107 Intake C/L.
The head are Tick Flow 23 they can handle the extra lift and flow but I will need to put different valve spring over .480 lift no big deal.
I have read a lot but most questions about this has been for Dual pattern Cam Shafts Not Single pattern Cams But What I gather mild Single camshaft you do set them up different than a dual pattern for high lift rocker arms it a street car.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Not sure I'd go with steel rocker arms.

Best bet, for your upgrade, would be Crane's Gold Race Rockers, 1.6 on the intake and 1.5 on the exhaust. The last Gen 1 SBV8 I built was set up that way and I ran it a long time with that set-up before I sold parted out the car and sold the motor. It's in an 82 CE somewhere in Arizona these days.

In any event, you already know to watch valve lift and coil bind. You also need to remember that for a given cam profile and valve spring pressure, when you increase the rocker ratio you lower the RPM at which valve float may occur so...plan accordingly.

 

[Marv02]

Thanks I trying to get all to input I can get before I spend more money and get the best bang for the buck.

Why Crane Aluminun Rockers I would think Steel would be better for a street motor and they will last longer.

If i have to swap out the valve springs I wil but the ones in the heads now are rated for .480 lift.

Not sure I'd go with steel rocker arms.

Best bet, for your upgrade, would be Crane's Gold Race Rockers, 1.6 on the intake and 1.5 on the exhaust. The last Gen 1 SBV8 I built was set up that way and I ran it a long time with that set-up before I sold parted out the car and sold the motor. It's in an 82 CE somewhere in Arizona these days.

In any event, you already know to watch valve lift and coil bind. You also need to remember that for a given cam profile and valve spring pressure, when you increase the rocker ratio you lower the RPM at which valve float may occur so...plan accordingly.

 

[Marv02]

What brand RRA are you using and how many mile do you have on them.

 

[catbert]

Comp Cams have been the leading supplier of cams/kits for Vettes since the early C4s. Ask them for a recommendation.

 

[Marv02]

I heard good and bad about Comp Cams stuff I sure CC going to try to make there product is the best every made not saying there not good.

But It's nice to hear other that have used the product give there input also.

Comp Cams have been the leading supplier of cams/kits for Vettes since the early C4s. Ask them for a recommendation.

 

[catbert]

I heard good ad bad about Comp Cams stuff I sure CC going to try to make there product is the best every made not saying there not good.

But It's nice to hear other that have used the product give there input also.

I used Comp Cams and lifters when I seriously raced C4s. I never had a problem, and won more than I lost - by far.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Comp Cams have been the leading supplier of cams/kits for Vettes since the early C4s. Ask them for a recommendation.

Gosh darn-it...I hate to be a rag to one of the Moderators, but "Catbert"...could you supply a little evidence to support your statement about COMP being the "...leading supplier of cams/kits for Vettes since the early C4s."?

Perhaps you can post some of the research you've done into the Corvette cam/kit sales figures for the several major aftermarket cam companies?

 

[catbert]

Gosh darn-it...I hate to be a rag to one of the Moderators, but "Catbert"...could you supply a little evidence to support your statement about COMP being the "...leading supplier of cams/kits for Vettes since the early C4s."?

Perhaps you can post some of the research you've done into the Corvette cam/kit sales figures for the several major aftermarket cam companies?

Sorry - should have said "a" leading supplier.

 

[boomdriver]

Thanks I trying to get all to input I can get before I spend more money and get the best bang for the buck.

Why Crane Aluminun Rockers I would think Steel would be better for a street motor and they will last longer.

If i have to swap out the valve springs I wil but the ones in the heads now are rated for .480 lift.

A couple thoughts...

a higher ratio on the exhaust is not nearly as much a concern as the intake because the exhaust flow is under pressure, and the intake is a vacume. The intake benefits much more since the piston is doing the work of pushing the gases out. I've seen more people stay with 1.5 ex. I wonder if the bigger ex lift starts to effect low-end power?

Do you have a good idea of how much room you have inside after machining the valve reliefs on the pistons? Can the motor take the increase ratio with the current cam timing? I'd hate to see the bent push rods reappear..

As far as steel over alum..? I've seen more aluminum kits with a quality material and perhaps steel roller inserts and quality pins and rollers than steel rockers.
It may be only grams of weight off the valve train, but the faster & lighter valves AND the slight increase in gas flow adds up. Depending on the motor, aluminum roller rockers can free 3 to7 hp in a stock engine.
If for no other reason, the rollers are smoother. Any reduction in weight to valve train and the rotating assy will result in faster throttle response and less power wasted in the oil pan. Heck, even the oil pump uses several Hp....so it does matter.

 

[Marv02]

I got hold of others And what I gather I most likley go with 1.6 In 1.6 Ex Steel RRA.

It was recommended do to my low .447 lift cam put 1.6 on Intake and Exhaust this will make the lift .478 lift.

I be at almost the max lift for the valve springs the heads have in them now .480.

I willning to spend more cash this time around to get the good stuff.:W

 

[Hib Halverson]

Sorry - should have said "a" leading supplier.

Amazing how one little letter can make a huge change in the meaning, eh?

No doubt COMP is a leading supplier of SBC camshafts.

 

[Hib Halverson]

Ok.
I like my crow medium rare.

When I read the first post I confused the COMP's "Ultra Pro Magnum" with COMP's "Magnum" steel, roller tip rocker.

The Magnum roller tips are a waste of money, but that Ultra Pro Magnum steel roller rocker arm is a nice piece...maybe even overkill for the application, but nevertheless, a killer product. It should work really well in that engine.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Mac]

Ok.
I like my crow medium rare.

I've yet to find a sauce which makes crow taste good. How about you, Hib?

-Mac

 

[Marv02]

I want to get a set of COMP's "Ultra Pro Magnum.

I know it's over kill I looked hard at a good set of Aluminum RRA yes they are about $100.00 cheeper BUT doing some digging they are saying you should swap them out every 30000 to 40000 miles or so.

Once I get All the bugs of this new buld all worked out I dont want to open the motor back up the Stock Stamped Steel RA lasted for 145000 Miles and 25 years old If I get anouther 100000 + Miles out the new rebuilt 357 motor before it has to be opened up again I be happy.

This why I will spend the extra $100.00 on the COMP's "Ultra Pro Magnum.

The only way I can see if the motor had to pulled back apart if the Flat tapped cam go's flat I also thinking do I want to spend the money and time Now to put a full rolller cam system in the car Now or wait untill it go's flat.

I want a litttle Nastyer sounding Cam with more over lap set up anyways but nothing to loopy just enough you can hear it and it can be a DD when needed.

I very hard to tell what cam to get just by reading cam specs I like the LPE 219/219 but will it be to much for what I need it for Same for the LPE 213/219 and the 211/219 I wish someone had a video of each sound of these cam when at idel and there reveiws about the cams and how they liked them using the TPI.

Ok.
I like my crow medium rare.

When I read the first post I confused the COMP's "Ultra Pro Magnum" with COMP's "Magnum" steel, roller tip rocker.

The Magnum roller tips are a waste of money, but that Ultra Pro Magnum steel roller rocker arm is a nice piece...maybe even overkill for the application, but nevertheless, a killer product. It should work really well in that engine.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[Hib Halverson]

The belief that aluminum rockers only last 30,000-40,000 miles I have found not to be true as a rule.

The parts that wear in an aluminum rocker are the same that wear in a steel rocker, the bearings in the fulcrum and tip. Roller rocker (aluminum or steel) bearing life will depend on duty cycle and valve spring pressure.

On your choice in camshafts, I'd be cautious about choosing a camshaft profile in the basis of how it sounds. That said, COMP has a line of cams called "Thumper" that is designed specifically to sound nasty.

 

[Marv02]

I know I will not just pick a cam because the sound it makes I need one that will work well with my Engine combo and operating range I dont need a motor that rev's past 5200 to 5800 is pushing it.

This motor will never be a high reving and oncew in the blue moon see 5200 to 5500 or more RPM's.

I also trying to thinking if going with a Full roller cam set up is worth the money.
As in a LPE 21/219 or 213/213, Tpis ZZ9 Cost for this swap Ball park $1000.00

Or go back to anouther Hyd flat tappet cam is in the following link.

Lunati 00016LK - Lunati Bracket Master II Cam and Lifter Kits - Overview - SummitRacing.com


Ball Park Cost $300.00

Ball park is for everything includes Gasket and oil Ect.


As for the RRA I can see what you mean about the bearings so which Aluminum RRA that will last 100000 miles +.

The belief that aluminum rockers only last 30,000-40,000 miles I have found not to be true as a rule.

The parts that wear in an aluminum rocker are the same that wear in a steel rocker, the bearings in the fulcrum and tip. Roller rocker (aluminum or steel) bearing life will depend on duty cycle and valve spring pressure.

On your choice in camshafts, I'd be cautious about choosing a camshaft profile in the basis of how it sounds. That said, COMP has a line of cams called "Thumper" that is designed specifically to sound nasty.

 

[Hib Halverson]

With your aggressive cam profile and valve springs to keep the valve train stable at 5800 rpm, it's unlkely (but not impossible) that you're going to get 100,000 mile durability. It will depend on the duty cycle.

Unless you're using the car to commute a 200 miles a day, I suspect you'll never need to worry about 100,000 mile durability, anyway.

 

[Marv02]

What aggressive cam profile LOL.

In most cases it a 25 mle trip each way to work.

Every now and then we do drive it 200 miles one way but not much.

What do you think about the LT4 cam shaft do you think it pass CA Smog.

Sometimes we go down to LA and get stuck in the wounderful traffic down there will the LT4 cam work in traffic.

With your aggressive cam profile and valve springs to keep the valve train stable at 5800 rpm, it's unlkely (but not impossible) that you're going to get 100,000 mile durability. It will depend on the duty cycle.

Unless you're using the car to commute a 200 miles a day, I suspect you'll never need to worry about 100,000 mile durability, anyway.

 

[Schrade]

I know I will not just pick a cam because the sound it makes

I will think that's why peoples chooses the cams cause the sounds it makes yup.